I apologize. My dad isn't very knowledgable of WotC. But since Hasbro is the LLC, which is a very risky decision, all their subsidiaries fall under the same bylaws, and Hasbro would have to shut down MTGO so they can be investigated, that would lead to a longer process since it would go through the "Mothership" instead of WotC and it would just be a longer process.
Look, don't kill the messenger. I hate the legal process as much as the next guy and even though I passed the LSATS, I didn't go to law school for that reason.
I know they don't want to encourage gambling, but they essentially are.
I mean they are giving people access to a secondary market where tickets are being sold for real money. I mean they cracked down on Craigslist for something similar.
But regardless, without the ability to use FTP to trade tickets for real money (or any poker site), but you can still do so on PayPal, even though WotC has said that they don't have anything to do with the secondary market, it is the perfect place to launder money.
Don't be surprised if a person gets mad at Wizards and reports them to the SEC. They could have their entire system shut down and a full investigation could ensue.
**This is from my dad, a former Business Lawyer only a few years ago. "Wizards of the Coast chose to become a LLC or Limited Liability Corp.. Since there hasn't been enough cases to understand what a LLC ensues, if it turns out that if someone becomes unhappy with WotC, then the SEC could shut it down and every member of the MTGO community could file a class action law suit while the SEC investigates if there is any illegal activity going on, potentially shutting down MTGO for a VERY LONG TIME".
I don't agree that Legacy's woes are due to hoarding. I have just skimmed some major Bot chains for duals. Masters 4 Duals are generally available. Whether you consider prices reasonable is a matter of opinion, but they have been pretty constant and are no less affordable than standard Mythics (Underground Seas @ 28 tix- Plateaux @ 6.5). MED2 Duals are rarer.
I do take the point about Mental Misstep. Like seydaneen, I also think that Legacy and Modern are competing for a limited pool of players, to the detriment of both.
Hi, first I want to thank you for taking the time to put up all this content.
You've asked for constructive criticism, so here's mine. I think your results will be better if you don't react so negatively when things go against you. A glaring example of this was round 3 game 1 with your GW deck (nicely drafted btw). Right at the end the game was coming down to the wire and he played a snapcaster and flashed back his devils play. He then followed up with a murder of crows and you just seemed to lose focus, complaining of bad luck. You rightly attacked with your equiped orchard spirit but then failed to pump him and save him with moment of heroism. This would have taken you to 10 life and left you with basically a 4 power flyer. Absorb 1 hit from the thraben use your fiend hunter to chump his last hit and the game was yours.
Like Alternate said "Lighten up" roll with the punches, people will draft good cards and you will lose to them sometimes, but don't tilt when someone gets a good topdeck and throw away a winnable game.
Keep up the good work and I'm looking forward to the next installation.
Im positive that would not fly as ideas go as Wizards does not even want to appear to be encouraging gambling much less being seen to be involved in it from a legal standpoint.
If wizards really want the formats to succeed they should offer more rewards for the less popular formats and or have raffle/lotto for attending. I.E. for modern 4 round swiss give 2 packs for 6 points, and enter into a drawing for a free draft pack every enter. thatll learn em.
I'm really not sure I support the decision to rename "Casual Decks" as "Just For Fun." It seems like WotC is just opening the floodgates for cutthroat decks to run even more rampant in the non-tournament room, leaving casual players with even less of a venue. I really don't want to play against a top 8 decklist when I've got my Varchild's War-Riders combo going, and it seems like I won't have a choice now. Of course it's too early to tell how it will turn out, and I hope that my prediction is wrong. But I'm cringing at the thought of a tournament-winning netdeck being played "just for fun."
Round 2 in response to Villager you should have cast the Tribute. Stormkirk would have gotten in for a counter since Bell-Ringer can't block it, and you wouldn't have thrown away your guy.
As far as your rebuttal to my comments goes I'm really wondering if you read what I wrote. I specifically said that bombs were not the issue with the format. If anything bombs are much less of an issue than any set from the last 5 years.
First off, GO GEORGIA. If you are a fan of sports you better be praying to whatever god is fashionable at the moment that Georgia beat's LSU so the BCS crumbles to pieces.
Second, this format is fun. This is the most fun I have had drafting since I quit over a decade ago.
The bombs are mostly common, so there is a high amount of them, and it really comes down to skill, because yes, you can win with mono-black, but you can also lose to Bloodcrazed Neonate (Neonate means young child or baby btw) or Caravan Vigil, or Makeshift Mauler, or even Gnaw to the Bone. I once had a guy go up to 50 life with that damn card.
The rare bombs aren't bombs in the limited sense. I mean Geist of Tramp Stamp is terrible in drafts unless you figure out a way of using it correctly. Snappy the Snapcasting Mage is 'ok' but just that in limited. Lilliana loses in drafts to Midnight Haunting. Even Bloodgrift Demon gets killed by a lot of commons.
The only "broken" bombs are Gavonry Township, but there are commons that can get rid of it, even though they are overlooked or into the maw of hell if you are playing red. Curse of Deaths Hold is a great limited card, but it dies to the Fox, Urgent Exorcism, or Naturalize. Even Paralescence (I spelled that wrong) if you get passed one really late. Angelic Overseer is insane in limited, but make a poor move and it loses it's invincibility. And Bloodline Keeper is a good card, but people are scared to attack with it so they use it to make 2/2 flyers which could lead to you having the time to get something to kill it.
The only rares that scare me are Grim Grim, Garruk, or Blasphemous Act if your opponent is smart or has Rage Thrower/Black Vampire that lets you gain life and lose life (I forget names). Oh and Olivia is good, but if you are playing WG, don't take Olivia and start taking Red Black. I did that twice, won split an 8-4 once and lost in the first round of another.
This isn't anything like SOM block where if your opponent had a card like the flyer that gives counters, or the Contagion Engine. And if your opponent has Wurmcoil Engine, sword, or (Baby)BatterSkull, ugh.
The only downside to ISD is the lack of money cards. So many of the rares are worth very little or nothing, regardless of how good. Even the mythics are cheap. Olivia had a quick run. Snappy, if he was Mythic would be worth $5,000, but he is a rare and will be around $7 sooner than later, and then will keep dropping because the market is flooded with them.
But you are right, Black was overlooked early. I mean in a set based on Supernatural, you would think Black would be better. But people are starting to come around, but the removal gets thrown out the window if you play zombies or vampires or your opponent has Werewolves.
I didn't say it was high variance because of bombs I said it was high variance because of the synergies. This seems counter-intuitive but if you think about it it's really not. Ordinarily you can have a super high chance of losing in any format from mana issues or too much or too little. Here if you are playing any of the graveyard matters decks it's often like you're running a 4 color deck that needs all 4 colors. Draw both colors in good amount and enablers only, you probably lose, draw good on land and no enablers, you probably lose. Stumble on early turns with any deck vs werewolves, they flip you die. Play werewolves vs someone who can keep them from flipping or flip them back, you die. God draws in black red, green white and blue white beat almost any draw. Rock paper scissors matches. Play vs the strong control deck is sometimes like 20/80 odds against your aggro deck. Play the control deck and face the ghoulraiser chain or the mill deck and if you can't tempo them out (which means youre playing tempo and not control anyway) and you lose 80/20. Go all in on drafting a strategy that looks open only to have it dry up, probably lose to anyone with a decent deck. Play vs the guy who went all in and got what he needed, you probably just lose. I could go on lol. Other formats I have not noticed to have nearly the frequency of these issues.
Lower variance in limited formats comes from more combinations of opening hands and later draws being viable without absurd advantage surges from your opponent's mini-comboes going off. IT makes the format seem fun though which is what Wizards wants. It's perfectly designed from a sales perspective.
Don't know why people don't like ghoulraiser more. If he's your only zombie with alter's reap or skirsdag cultist you can put his trigger on the stack and then sac him returning himself. I have won drafts with monoblack or near monoblack in the format. It's a deck that needs a good amount of removal but since you already had that I don't see the makeshift mauler pick as being a good one over the ghoul. You can warp a draft pretty well by cutting all the black payables (since there are only a few black cards people really want to play if theyre not already heavy black) giving you increasing returns pack 2 and 3. Just my 2 cents there. Blue looks better than it is in the format imo in any case.
I would just come up with a rule where the "commanding" tribe will be the one listed first in alphabetical order. :P
You guys will not manage to mess up my (and Vantar's) statistics. :P
What do you mean? I mentioned you, but your decklist wasn't in the forum -- it wasn't requested to be, since it didn't get prizes. Vantar posted his own anyway, and I noticed that peculiarity so I wanted to talk about it. I didn't mean to exclude anyone. :)
The other Premium Decks (Slivers and Fire & Lightning) were given as prizes to the winners of events.
Fire & Lightning: Each player who finishes with either a record of 4-0 in a Daily Event or reaches the "Top 8" playoff of a Premier Event will receive 12/15/2010 to 1/5/2011
Slivers: 2/6/2010 6pm until 2/7/2010 6pm Winners of Alara Block Foil drafts
Yeah, the Slivers one was a little stingier: 24 hours to win a draft using product you couldn't buy in the store vs. 3 weeks of daily and premiere events.
That was something both Flippers_Giraffe and I wrote about a while back. It is definitely a fun idea ....hybrid tribal. Tough to balance correctly though. Easy to make too weak to stand.
Another good read, really enjoy these articles (this one in particular as it's a less played deck and I've been itching to run it). I'd love some further insight on how you'd change it for red if you've implemented anything or have further thought into it. Nice to see another Arizona player btw, I'm from the superior college town of Tucson :) Oh last thing, I'd love to see sideboard ins/outs after games for the different matchups in the articles, definitely my weak point. Thanks for the article!
Now the real trick would be taking two tribes with identical numbers, running 11 each of both and 9 changelings. Valid pairings include barbarian/nomad, artificer/monk, dwarf/elephant/kor/viashino/centaur/berserker/lizard/spider (there are a LOT of 31-member tribes), ally/vedalken, bear/fish, horse/bat/crocodile, and quite a few at the lower end of the scale.
Hope you don’t mind a critique – but by playing with unmatching lands (different artists) and/or foil/nonfoil/diff.art permanents… you’re putting your opponent at a big advantage. Anytime you bounce a permanent, or play something different that what was revealed…it’s as if I get a free duress.
I love facing that deck. It totally rolls over and plays dead to anything with access to instant 1 damage capabilities..(see lavadart/s.spray and the like). Delver is new, and that is why it's popular...good card, but in my opinion is a TERRIBLE choice over the ALWAYS superior Pestermite...which you can't name a scenerio where you don't want it.. Delver is an awful topdeck turns 2 till the endgame, and is very likely to just stay at a silly Fugitive Wizard in a format that eats those for lunch. This build is great vs. some decks, but most come at the ready, and Echoing Truth is no answer for ETW vs. a good pilot...who will just kill fae/tokens in response.
I apologize. My dad isn't very knowledgable of WotC. But since Hasbro is the LLC, which is a very risky decision, all their subsidiaries fall under the same bylaws, and Hasbro would have to shut down MTGO so they can be investigated, that would lead to a longer process since it would go through the "Mothership" instead of WotC and it would just be a longer process.
Look, don't kill the messenger. I hate the legal process as much as the next guy and even though I passed the LSATS, I didn't go to law school for that reason.
I know they don't want to encourage gambling, but they essentially are.
I mean they are giving people access to a secondary market where tickets are being sold for real money. I mean they cracked down on Craigslist for something similar.
But regardless, without the ability to use FTP to trade tickets for real money (or any poker site), but you can still do so on PayPal, even though WotC has said that they don't have anything to do with the secondary market, it is the perfect place to launder money.
Don't be surprised if a person gets mad at Wizards and reports them to the SEC. They could have their entire system shut down and a full investigation could ensue.
**This is from my dad, a former Business Lawyer only a few years ago. "Wizards of the Coast chose to become a LLC or Limited Liability Corp.. Since there hasn't been enough cases to understand what a LLC ensues, if it turns out that if someone becomes unhappy with WotC, then the SEC could shut it down and every member of the MTGO community could file a class action law suit while the SEC investigates if there is any illegal activity going on, potentially shutting down MTGO for a VERY LONG TIME".
I don't agree that Legacy's woes are due to hoarding. I have just skimmed some major Bot chains for duals. Masters 4 Duals are generally available. Whether you consider prices reasonable is a matter of opinion, but they have been pretty constant and are no less affordable than standard Mythics (Underground Seas @ 28 tix- Plateaux @ 6.5). MED2 Duals are rarer.
I do take the point about Mental Misstep. Like seydaneen, I also think that Legacy and Modern are competing for a limited pool of players, to the detriment of both.
Hi, first I want to thank you for taking the time to put up all this content.
You've asked for constructive criticism, so here's mine. I think your results will be better if you don't react so negatively when things go against you. A glaring example of this was round 3 game 1 with your GW deck (nicely drafted btw). Right at the end the game was coming down to the wire and he played a snapcaster and flashed back his devils play. He then followed up with a murder of crows and you just seemed to lose focus, complaining of bad luck. You rightly attacked with your equiped orchard spirit but then failed to pump him and save him with moment of heroism. This would have taken you to 10 life and left you with basically a 4 power flyer. Absorb 1 hit from the thraben use your fiend hunter to chump his last hit and the game was yours.
Like Alternate said "Lighten up" roll with the punches, people will draft good cards and you will lose to them sometimes, but don't tilt when someone gets a good topdeck and throw away a winnable game.
Keep up the good work and I'm looking forward to the next installation.
Im positive that would not fly as ideas go as Wizards does not even want to appear to be encouraging gambling much less being seen to be involved in it from a legal standpoint.
If wizards really want the formats to succeed they should offer more rewards for the less popular formats and or have raffle/lotto for attending. I.E. for modern 4 round swiss give 2 packs for 6 points, and enter into a drawing for a free draft pack every enter. thatll learn em.
I'm really not sure I support the decision to rename "Casual Decks" as "Just For Fun." It seems like WotC is just opening the floodgates for cutthroat decks to run even more rampant in the non-tournament room, leaving casual players with even less of a venue. I really don't want to play against a top 8 decklist when I've got my Varchild's War-Riders combo going, and it seems like I won't have a choice now. Of course it's too early to tell how it will turn out, and I hope that my prediction is wrong. But I'm cringing at the thought of a tournament-winning netdeck being played "just for fun."
Round 2 in response to Villager you should have cast the Tribute. Stormkirk would have gotten in for a counter since Bell-Ringer can't block it, and you wouldn't have thrown away your guy.
As far as your rebuttal to my comments goes I'm really wondering if you read what I wrote. I specifically said that bombs were not the issue with the format. If anything bombs are much less of an issue than any set from the last 5 years.
First off, GO GEORGIA. If you are a fan of sports you better be praying to whatever god is fashionable at the moment that Georgia beat's LSU so the BCS crumbles to pieces.
Second, this format is fun. This is the most fun I have had drafting since I quit over a decade ago.
The bombs are mostly common, so there is a high amount of them, and it really comes down to skill, because yes, you can win with mono-black, but you can also lose to Bloodcrazed Neonate (Neonate means young child or baby btw) or Caravan Vigil, or Makeshift Mauler, or even Gnaw to the Bone. I once had a guy go up to 50 life with that damn card.
The rare bombs aren't bombs in the limited sense. I mean Geist of Tramp Stamp is terrible in drafts unless you figure out a way of using it correctly. Snappy the Snapcasting Mage is 'ok' but just that in limited. Lilliana loses in drafts to Midnight Haunting. Even Bloodgrift Demon gets killed by a lot of commons.
The only "broken" bombs are Gavonry Township, but there are commons that can get rid of it, even though they are overlooked or into the maw of hell if you are playing red. Curse of Deaths Hold is a great limited card, but it dies to the Fox, Urgent Exorcism, or Naturalize. Even Paralescence (I spelled that wrong) if you get passed one really late. Angelic Overseer is insane in limited, but make a poor move and it loses it's invincibility. And Bloodline Keeper is a good card, but people are scared to attack with it so they use it to make 2/2 flyers which could lead to you having the time to get something to kill it.
The only rares that scare me are Grim Grim, Garruk, or Blasphemous Act if your opponent is smart or has Rage Thrower/Black Vampire that lets you gain life and lose life (I forget names). Oh and Olivia is good, but if you are playing WG, don't take Olivia and start taking Red Black. I did that twice, won split an 8-4 once and lost in the first round of another.
This isn't anything like SOM block where if your opponent had a card like the flyer that gives counters, or the Contagion Engine. And if your opponent has Wurmcoil Engine, sword, or (Baby)BatterSkull, ugh.
The only downside to ISD is the lack of money cards. So many of the rares are worth very little or nothing, regardless of how good. Even the mythics are cheap. Olivia had a quick run. Snappy, if he was Mythic would be worth $5,000, but he is a rare and will be around $7 sooner than later, and then will keep dropping because the market is flooded with them.
But you are right, Black was overlooked early. I mean in a set based on Supernatural, you would think Black would be better. But people are starting to come around, but the removal gets thrown out the window if you play zombies or vampires or your opponent has Werewolves.
I didn't say it was high variance because of bombs I said it was high variance because of the synergies. This seems counter-intuitive but if you think about it it's really not. Ordinarily you can have a super high chance of losing in any format from mana issues or too much or too little. Here if you are playing any of the graveyard matters decks it's often like you're running a 4 color deck that needs all 4 colors. Draw both colors in good amount and enablers only, you probably lose, draw good on land and no enablers, you probably lose. Stumble on early turns with any deck vs werewolves, they flip you die. Play werewolves vs someone who can keep them from flipping or flip them back, you die. God draws in black red, green white and blue white beat almost any draw. Rock paper scissors matches. Play vs the strong control deck is sometimes like 20/80 odds against your aggro deck. Play the control deck and face the ghoulraiser chain or the mill deck and if you can't tempo them out (which means youre playing tempo and not control anyway) and you lose 80/20. Go all in on drafting a strategy that looks open only to have it dry up, probably lose to anyone with a decent deck. Play vs the guy who went all in and got what he needed, you probably just lose. I could go on lol. Other formats I have not noticed to have nearly the frequency of these issues.
Lower variance in limited formats comes from more combinations of opening hands and later draws being viable without absurd advantage surges from your opponent's mini-comboes going off. IT makes the format seem fun though which is what Wizards wants. It's perfectly designed from a sales perspective.
Don't know why people don't like ghoulraiser more. If he's your only zombie with alter's reap or skirsdag cultist you can put his trigger on the stack and then sac him returning himself. I have won drafts with monoblack or near monoblack in the format. It's a deck that needs a good amount of removal but since you already had that I don't see the makeshift mauler pick as being a good one over the ghoul. You can warp a draft pretty well by cutting all the black payables (since there are only a few black cards people really want to play if theyre not already heavy black) giving you increasing returns pack 2 and 3. Just my 2 cents there. Blue looks better than it is in the format imo in any case.
I would just come up with a rule where the "commanding" tribe will be the one listed first in alphabetical order. :P
You guys will not manage to mess up my (and Vantar's) statistics. :P
Now you have to run this deck in the tournament. :)
What do you mean? I mentioned you, but your decklist wasn't in the forum -- it wasn't requested to be, since it didn't get prizes. Vantar posted his own anyway, and I noticed that peculiarity so I wanted to talk about it. I didn't mean to exclude anyone. :)
Thanks.
No promises, but if I can get home from work in time, I'll try to get there. I should have time to play at least one round. :)
Hi! We play Heirloom - casual competetive budget format - each sunday! CHEAPER THAN PAUPER!!!!
Information can be found here:
http://mtgoheirloom.webs.com/apps/forums/topics/show/6921933-heirloom-pr...
http://community.wizards.com/go/thread/view/75846/28719665/Heirloom_PRE_...
Hope to see you soon ;-)
BTW: What is fun, and what isn't fun???
exactly...still valid. I copy/paste that as so many make the error, over and OVER...
The other Premium Decks (Slivers and Fire & Lightning) were given as prizes to the winners of events.
Fire & Lightning: Each player who finishes with either a record of 4-0 in a Daily Event or reaches the "Top 8" playoff of a Premier Event will receive 12/15/2010 to 1/5/2011
Slivers: 2/6/2010 6pm until 2/7/2010 6pm Winners of Alara Block Foil drafts
Yeah, the Slivers one was a little stingier: 24 hours to win a draft using product you couldn't buy in the store vs. 3 weeks of daily and premiere events.
http://www.wizards.com/magic/magazine/Article.aspx?x=mtg/daily/other/121...
http://www.wizards.com/Magic/Magazine/Article.aspx?x=mtg/daily/other/011...
That was something both Flippers_Giraffe and I wrote about a while back. It is definitely a fun idea ....hybrid tribal. Tough to balance correctly though. Easy to make too weak to stand.
Another good read, really enjoy these articles (this one in particular as it's a less played deck and I've been itching to run it). I'd love some further insight on how you'd change it for red if you've implemented anything or have further thought into it. Nice to see another Arizona player btw, I'm from the superior college town of Tucson :) Oh last thing, I'd love to see sideboard ins/outs after games for the different matchups in the articles, definitely my weak point. Thanks for the article!
I'm pretty sure you said that last time he posted vids.
Now the real trick would be taking two tribes with identical numbers, running 11 each of both and 9 changelings. Valid pairings include barbarian/nomad, artificer/monk, dwarf/elephant/kor/viashino/centaur/berserker/lizard/spider (there are a LOT of 31-member tribes), ally/vedalken, bear/fish, horse/bat/crocodile, and quite a few at the lower end of the scale.
Hope you don’t mind a critique – but by playing with unmatching lands (different artists) and/or foil/nonfoil/diff.art permanents… you’re putting your opponent at a big advantage. Anytime you bounce a permanent, or play something different that what was revealed…it’s as if I get a free duress.
I love facing that deck. It totally rolls over and plays dead to anything with access to instant 1 damage capabilities..(see lavadart/s.spray and the like). Delver is new, and that is why it's popular...good card, but in my opinion is a TERRIBLE choice over the ALWAYS superior Pestermite...which you can't name a scenerio where you don't want it.. Delver is an awful topdeck turns 2 till the endgame, and is very likely to just stay at a silly Fugitive Wizard in a format that eats those for lunch. This build is great vs. some decks, but most come at the ready, and Echoing Truth is no answer for ETW vs. a good pilot...who will just kill fae/tokens in response.