Not as much as you'd think but really am gettin sick of seeing the tribal crowd feel that they must insult every deck that might be of an "Archtype" or that's "not casual" Get over yourselves Traders sponsors a tournament not a place for the same 8-10 people to get paid to play with their friends and their fun decks.
oh I know it's not a big stop on them, but it still hurts when combined with discard and all and its great vs gobos, if i had the deeds i might try a switch there, but i dont lol
I still think plague is to slow. Merfolk players will easily work around it. The new list using Kira makes your targeted removal worthless vs their lords which they will just utilize to work around Plague. Plague also doesn't stop the spell from being cast so Matron still works. It does shut down Lackey but often times lackey is already doing his magic before you hit plague unless you go ritual into plague.
Not sure the answer, you have inspired me to test some BG fun this weekend.
a question: do you specifically list your forks and cornerstones as a pick list?
I mean: Would you really take vengevine this low in your picklist for the GW archetype?
If you don't list them as such, you should try, even if it makes it much harder.
For some reason I was thinking about Team America, duh Inkwell can be blocked. Why can't sphinx be blocked by nighthawk, it has prot from red and green not black. Am I missing something here?
Why Hexmage with no Depths. Wouldn't Shade be a better fit in that spot? I do like Great Stable, but the problem is most blue decks seem to run STP which is huge tempo loss considering he is a 3 drop. I am assuming you aren't running Tarmo for budget reasons?
The "Burn" deck only had 7 legitmate burn cards. (i suppose the argument could be made for tatics but seriously thats more anti discard tech then true burn) His deck is more set up for the soulstoke combo and sub shaman's theme then it is burn.
And then it's not like my reanimtor deck went 2-0 then 2-1 it actually went 1-1 then 2-1. And truthfully that's okay because I got lucky. Not because the deck was any good.(infact i could name several ways to improve the deck)Bottom line on that one....its a budget deck and played like one.
Just try understanding that this is a classic format and that games will on a regular basis end on turn 5 not 10 and you'll quit being so disappointed all of the time.
well perhaps this is a mistake on my part but the zoo decks I've faced so far I've been able to beat, if you get the discard they cant get the fast start
Eva does not fare well against Zoo or other fast aggro/burn. DD is one of the few ways you can beat zoo others being discard their removal and waste their lands followed by a stalker(pfft this line of play should beat just about any deck, but getting there in time vs the fast beats is the problem). Eva like Pox decks are at their best when eating up blue decks. Sinkhole only makes this deck better vs non aggro where you are good already. Nighthawk can beat Inkwell(and every other crit they play maybe aside the rare Akroma)esp since you have no Islands, but it can not beat Sphinx.
LOL that's a typo its supposed to be Engineered Plague not explosives
the land count maybe a little high, but 3-4 lands are Dark Depths which doesn't produce mana and I'm running 6 fetches, if ya get a chance to run the list it really isnt as land heavy as you might think, ritual is huge for turn 1-2 and getting some big plays off
yea I agree it might be a nice change for nighthawk from stalker
there still a few issues with the new list I have to tweak, first off the 1 depths in the side was a ridiculous idea, either I move it main deck or I drop it and I'm not sure the Jitte fits either
Absolutely no problem at all. For me the deck going up and the pride I take from that is worth far more than the tickets, but they certainly aren't scoffed at either!
Anyway, needless to say, no hard feelings. I hadn't even noticed the lack of prize until I didn't see my deck listed there.
Anyway see ya online, and thanks again for running the tourney.
Just wanted to add something here -- in both of these decks (especially the gnarlid deck) you want to take sideboard enchantment removal a bit higher than you normally would. Naturalize and Demystify are obviously good against you and you want to avoid letting them fall into opponent's hands. Hate drafting is not the only motivation though -- two of the removal spells that you least want to see are Narcolepsy and Guard Duty because they don't care about totem aura and turn your pumped gnarlid into a card disadvantage liability. EOT Naturalize your Demystify your Guard Duty/Narcolepsy is a huge turnaround play that will likely catch your opponent off guard.
I feel horrible. This is sadly a result of having to write a paper in spanish at the same time as hosting the event. I will certainly get in touch with heath to get you your prize.
Good informative article! When I looked over your list two things immediately jumped out at me. First of all, Engineered Explosives in the SB seems bad. You are only hitting 2cc at best with your mana base. Pernicious Deed would be better suited in there and should help shore up some of your harder matchups. Deed vs. Merfolk seems like a huge smiley face! Also, 24 lands plus Dark Ritual? I guess I need to go search the EvaGreen archives as I have shelved my version of it due to lack of sinkholes. Is 24 lands the standard here? Another thing to consider that you mentioned is Nighthawk. Tombstalkers are pretty awesome, but they don't have Deathtouch. This might help shore up reanimator as Nighthawk (if you are able to cast it) can easily kill all of their creatures cept Leviathan.
Edit: So I went and researched Eva lists and Depths lists. I looked at 10 lists, here were land counts.
EvaGreen:21,22,25,21,22,22,21,21,21,21 - Average 21.7
Dark Depths:22,22,23,22,19,23,23,20,23,22 - Average 21.9
I realize some of the lists I researched aren't exactly like yours, but I think your land count is high. Cutting down to 22 lands with Rituals frees up 2 more spots.
Also don't forget about Nantuko Shade and Hypnotic Spector. I realize spector isn't what it used to be, so maybe that is a bad idea.
Last but not least, I think crop rotation coming out soon is worth testing and might help speed up your combo!
I love the deck but worry about running it in this meta. Zoo is everywhere and I honestly think your matchup vs. Zoo isn't as good as one might think. You are taking hits from Bob and Seize and they can easily PTE your Marit. You could try sensei's in there with Bob to help set up the draws.
Oh how I love me some EvaGreen, bring me my SINKHOLES NOW!
Good draft walk through... but not great. A bit more detail or commentary on picks would have been very welcome, especially for those of us less good at drafting.
Eg. Why did you choose card x over card y? Did you even consider card z at all? Did you draft anything specifically as a hate or sideboard card? At what point did you consider yourself fixed into an archetype?
That kind of thing I find much more valuable than just seeing your final picks or final deck. :-)
turn down the tempers guys. Sure red has been winning a lot but then the decks are posted near weekly. Someone could have meta'd an answer by now
I find Hexmage good vs aggro decks and Jace. Yes Tarmo is because of my budget.
Not as much as you'd think but really am gettin sick of seeing the tribal crowd feel that they must insult every deck that might be of an "Archtype" or that's "not casual" Get over yourselves Traders sponsors a tournament not a place for the same 8-10 people to get paid to play with their friends and their fun decks.
defensive much?
oh I know it's not a big stop on them, but it still hurts when combined with discard and all and its great vs gobos, if i had the deeds i might try a switch there, but i dont lol
it can be blocked, but it doesnt matter that the hawk has deathtouch because the sphinx has first strike
I still think plague is to slow. Merfolk players will easily work around it. The new list using Kira makes your targeted removal worthless vs their lords which they will just utilize to work around Plague. Plague also doesn't stop the spell from being cast so Matron still works. It does shut down Lackey but often times lackey is already doing his magic before you hit plague unless you go ritual into plague.
Not sure the answer, you have inspired me to test some BG fun this weekend.
a question: do you specifically list your forks and cornerstones as a pick list?
I mean: Would you really take vengevine this low in your picklist for the GW archetype?
If you don't list them as such, you should try, even if it makes it much harder.
What deck next: G/x Ramp, R/x Vent Sentinel,
For some reason I was thinking about Team America, duh Inkwell can be blocked. Why can't sphinx be blocked by nighthawk, it has prot from red and green not black. Am I missing something here?
Why Hexmage with no Depths. Wouldn't Shade be a better fit in that spot? I do like Great Stable, but the problem is most blue decks seem to run STP which is huge tempo loss considering he is a 3 drop. I am assuming you aren't running Tarmo for budget reasons?
I keep enjoying this article series!
One suggestion though: i'd like to see some sample lists of deck you drafted yourself with every archetype.
Do you even look at the decklists before posting?
The "Burn" deck only had 7 legitmate burn cards. (i suppose the argument could be made for tatics but seriously thats more anti discard tech then true burn) His deck is more set up for the soulstoke combo and sub shaman's theme then it is burn.
And then it's not like my reanimtor deck went 2-0 then 2-1 it actually went 1-1 then 2-1. And truthfully that's okay because I got lucky. Not because the deck was any good.(infact i could name several ways to improve the deck)Bottom line on that one....its a budget deck and played like one.
Just try understanding that this is a classic format and that games will on a regular basis end on turn 5 not 10 and you'll quit being so disappointed all of the time.
well perhaps this is a mistake on my part but the zoo decks I've faced so far I've been able to beat, if you get the discard they cant get the fast start
reanimator, iona > black heavy deck lol but the sideboard changes evened up matches with reanimator now
Eva does not fare well against Zoo or other fast aggro/burn. DD is one of the few ways you can beat zoo others being discard their removal and waste their lands followed by a stalker(pfft this line of play should beat just about any deck, but getting there in time vs the fast beats is the problem). Eva like Pox decks are at their best when eating up blue decks. Sinkhole only makes this deck better vs non aggro where you are good already. Nighthawk can beat Inkwell(and every other crit they play maybe aside the rare Akroma)esp since you have no Islands, but it can not beat Sphinx.
I've got a pet Eva green deck I've been playing with for ages as well, this is my build at present.
I need to add another Jitte, I expect Goyf would help but Great Sable Stag isnt doing that bad at the moment.
3 Gatekeeper of Malakir
3 Great Sable Stag
3 Hypnotic Specter
1 Nyxathid
2 Tombstalker
2 Vampire Hexmage
3 Vampire Nighthawk
17 cards
Other Spells
3 Dark Ritual
2 Duress
4 Hymn to Tourach
2 Maelstrom Pulse
2 Pernicious Deed
3 Smother
3 Thoughtseize
1 Umezawa's Jitte
20 cards
Lands
4 Bayou
1 Forest
4 Overgrown Tomb
7 Swamp
4 Verdant Catacombs
3 Wasteland
23 cards
Sideboard
1 Choke
2 Helm of Obedience
4 Kitchen Finks
4 Leyline of the Void
2 Null Rod
2 Pithing Needle
15 cards
LOL that's a typo its supposed to be Engineered Plague not explosives
the land count maybe a little high, but 3-4 lands are Dark Depths which doesn't produce mana and I'm running 6 fetches, if ya get a chance to run the list it really isnt as land heavy as you might think, ritual is huge for turn 1-2 and getting some big plays off
yea I agree it might be a nice change for nighthawk from stalker
there still a few issues with the new list I have to tweak, first off the 1 depths in the side was a ridiculous idea, either I move it main deck or I drop it and I'm not sure the Jitte fits either
Shard:
Absolutely no problem at all. For me the deck going up and the pride I take from that is worth far more than the tickets, but they certainly aren't scoffed at either!
Anyway, needless to say, no hard feelings. I hadn't even noticed the lack of prize until I didn't see my deck listed there.
Anyway see ya online, and thanks again for running the tourney.
Just wanted to add something here -- in both of these decks (especially the gnarlid deck) you want to take sideboard enchantment removal a bit higher than you normally would. Naturalize and Demystify are obviously good against you and you want to avoid letting them fall into opponent's hands. Hate drafting is not the only motivation though -- two of the removal spells that you least want to see are Narcolepsy and Guard Duty because they don't care about totem aura and turn your pumped gnarlid into a card disadvantage liability. EOT Naturalize your Demystify your Guard Duty/Narcolepsy is a huge turnaround play that will likely catch your opponent off guard.
I feel horrible. This is sadly a result of having to write a paper in spanish at the same time as hosting the event. I will certainly get in touch with heath to get you your prize.
Good informative article! When I looked over your list two things immediately jumped out at me. First of all, Engineered Explosives in the SB seems bad. You are only hitting 2cc at best with your mana base. Pernicious Deed would be better suited in there and should help shore up some of your harder matchups. Deed vs. Merfolk seems like a huge smiley face! Also, 24 lands plus Dark Ritual? I guess I need to go search the EvaGreen archives as I have shelved my version of it due to lack of sinkholes. Is 24 lands the standard here? Another thing to consider that you mentioned is Nighthawk. Tombstalkers are pretty awesome, but they don't have Deathtouch. This might help shore up reanimator as Nighthawk (if you are able to cast it) can easily kill all of their creatures cept Leviathan.
Edit: So I went and researched Eva lists and Depths lists. I looked at 10 lists, here were land counts.
EvaGreen:21,22,25,21,22,22,21,21,21,21 - Average 21.7
Dark Depths:22,22,23,22,19,23,23,20,23,22 - Average 21.9
I realize some of the lists I researched aren't exactly like yours, but I think your land count is high. Cutting down to 22 lands with Rituals frees up 2 more spots.
Also don't forget about Nantuko Shade and Hypnotic Spector. I realize spector isn't what it used to be, so maybe that is a bad idea.
Last but not least, I think crop rotation coming out soon is worth testing and might help speed up your combo!
I love the deck but worry about running it in this meta. Zoo is everywhere and I honestly think your matchup vs. Zoo isn't as good as one might think. You are taking hits from Bob and Seize and they can easily PTE your Marit. You could try sensei's in there with Bob to help set up the draws.
Oh how I love me some EvaGreen, bring me my SINKHOLES NOW!
Good draft walk through... but not great. A bit more detail or commentary on picks would have been very welcome, especially for those of us less good at drafting.
Eg. Why did you choose card x over card y? Did you even consider card z at all? Did you draft anything specifically as a hate or sideboard card? At what point did you consider yourself fixed into an archetype?
That kind of thing I find much more valuable than just seeing your final picks or final deck. :-)
Still, as I say a good walk through. Thanks.
I also went 2-1 last week, check your email for the list there, it was sent right after they tourney.
I beat AJ impy and the birds deck for the 2-1 with my Eldrazi list.
now that i look into it, looks like i missed out on the prize too.
=(
Never hurts to read about decklists even if you're not planning on playing them. So you lost to Merfolk, what was your other loss to?
I literally think this is the 4th or 5th week in a row that a red/x deck has won