Our sadness is because instead of the P9 which we were all clamoring for we got duals which we already had and in some cases spent quite a bit on. so we didn't get what we want and what we already had lost value.
And duals weren't the bottleneck... anyone who wanted to play could have easily obtained the ones they need. most decks require 6-7 duals and a bunch of fetches. Doesn't come close to the price of 4x FoW.
So oeverall this is still a net postive for legacy/classic as it will get more players... but the hardcore Classic players all had their hopes up for p9.
I dabbled in Magic from time to time but the first set I opened in bulk (drafting) was Ravnica. I remember the first shock land I opened was Sacred Foundry. This was both exciting for me (as it was worth I believe near 15 tickets) but also pretty boring because it was a land. I feel the same way about this issue today. Having chase lands is very boring. I've always wanted to branch out into other formats from but dual lands would be the last thing I would ever want to buy because they don't do anything. Sure, they fix your mana and are almost needed for some of those formats but they're the most boring type of cards to own. Since I don't own any of the duals, this will be good for me. Maybe I will crack a few from drafting ME4 and then I will have incentive to buy the remaining lands. Lowering the price of them would also convince me to join a legacy/classic event and getting players into these events (as mentioned above) would be a great thing as they don't always fire. The ultimate MED4 would have the Dual Lands, FOW, and Power 9, making nearly everyone happy. But we got what we got.
There is definitely an elitist divide between those who want to encourage new blood and those who like being able to play with expensive cards not many others have. But also some people probably look at those cards as an investment which in this case has just become a situation where they either panic sell now or hold and hope it rises again so that if they do want to get out at sometime they still can afford to.
Some event prize structures encourage this type of attitude. It's really kind of sad.
The weekend challenges in particular encourage the player base to get just enough players to make it fire, but every player after the minimum number simply dilutes the prizes. This gets really hairy with the top 8 style of events where people are always losing out on prizes due to tiebreaker points. Not to mention that a 6+ hour tournament with a top 8 play-off is not the mostly friendly type of environment for a new player.
These are the main reasons I don't really like the weekend challenges. I'm in the minority in this opinion, but that's because the prizes are crazy good with a 24 people turn-out.
I want growth in the classic based formats, specifically 100 singleton, but some players just seem interested in farming the weekend challenges for all they're worth.
Without FOWs reprints, the overall cost is not going to change anyway. For every dollar you save on the duals, FOWs is going to sky rocket. Especially, if new players are introduced.
I'm with LE on this one, I currently don't have the duals because I sold them all, but a couple weeks ago I did have them and I still would feel the same about the reprint
I just don't understand this way of thinking. Those who own the duals are the ones who play Classic and Legacy. And surely they want more new faces joining their ranks. And when some expensive cards get reprinted and become available to the masses, they become... sad? Really?
You can't say "Hey join Legacy it's so much fun!" and then get sad because more people will be able to join Legacy. That's absurd!
Or do I get it all wrong? Do they want to be left alone? Do they want that Legacy and Classic remain as a "Club for the Privileged"? If that's the case, then yeah, today is definitely a bad day.
But otherwise they should be happy that at least some of the cards that prevent people from playing Legacy will be available to more players. More affordable cards = more new faces. And that's a good thing, right?
It seems that it depends on which side of the fence you are on when it comes to the reprint of the Duals. IF you already have them, you are sad, while those who don't have them or the ones they need are happy to see a reprint.
I'm happy to see Atog at common for pauper affinity decks.
Conversion - Rare, why? The original was uncommon and it's just as bad. I don't like setting fire to four dollars.
Leeches - Rare. At least you won't see this card often in draft. That's good because it can't be used in a draft of this set: zero poison creatures.
It seems like each color has 2-3 rares that will see play after the draft is over, most of which are restricted. The other colored rares are junk. The Lands color is the big winner; maze, 10 duals, workshop.
Except for Balance and Armageddon, the white rares are universally horrible.
Green has fastbond and regrowth.
Red has Wheel and Fork.
Black has Sinkhole, tutor, and a few kitchen table fun cards (hordes, word of command).
Blue has Stasis and Serendib.
Berserk - not reprinted. Still only available from FTV: E.
Sorrow's Path - not reprinted. We can be thankful for that.
ME4 will be great for the casual Legacy/Classic players because of the reprinting of the dual lands. If the power 9 was reprinted, I doubt they would leave them unbanned in 100 singleton or classic tribal. I think this will be great for 100 singleton because it will lower the main cost of entry into the format for any deck other than mono-colored weenie decks.
I must admit that this is pretty bad news for tournament spikes who want classic to turn into Vintage.
Everything I wanted to see here was here and more, personally I feel this set seems a lot better then the previous MEs, but I agree after seeing the reprint of the dual lands it seems a mistake to have left FoW off
Stasis: players don't have an untap step
Seedborn Muse: untap your permanents during each other players' untap
In other words, the "combo" doesn't work.
Stasis + Forsaken City works
Stasis + Mind Over Matter works
Stasis + BoP + Instill Energy works (same set, barring the Birds)
Stasis + Chronatog works
Add Root Maze, Frozen AEther or Loxodon Gatekeeper to any of these to complete the lock.
Gave a version of it a try, amongst other tweaks, I put in eternal witness and nim deathmantle. The nim deathmantle combined with the sac outlet is just a great little combo to begin with, and used it for much fun and profit with terrastodon and the yavimaya dryad, but nothing beat recurring damnation over and over with eternal witness.
BTW, how did you change your MTGO screen appearance from the default?
I'm excited for this. I am going to draft this set a lot, something I've never done for a master's edition set before. I've wanted to get into legacy for a while and hopefully this set will be what can ease the pain of getting the duals.
Also, there is something wrong with your Ajani Vengeant data because I'm pretty sure at no time last week was he trading for 20 tickets. If anything, I'd say he gained about a ticket to hit the 7.50 mark. And if you look at his price chart there is clearly something wrong there.
Ok. I have no problem with them reprinting duals. It helps players get into the format. I am trying to reenter the format after a 2 year hiatus. Last night I picked up a pair of tropical islands for 20 each and daze for 8 each (before i heard about the reprinting). This set will help me out.
Now that being said....WHY WASNT FOW REPRINTED? So that want a bunch of new players for legacy but at the moment have to spend $300 on a playset of FOW's if they can find them. WOTC must want FOW to hit $150. If they had reprinted FOW this would of been a homerun for the new player looking to get into legacy.
The example of Baneslayer reprinting is really not accurate. Right now Baneslayer Angel has no real deck. I think that is the reason for the low cost now. If tomorrow the best deck in standard had Baneslayer Angel in it then you would see the price climb and climb. The duals on the other hand are used in every deck. SO their playability will never be a factor. I think and this is my opinion only...Undergournd Sea will be $30, Tundra and Tropical Island $20. The rest around $9-$12.
Yeah mox mirror is broken beyond broken. In fact, I don't even think manacraft works within the rules? How does the game state know whether or not you could have made a land drop?
I think the first one is actually fairly reasonable, except that it's absolutely no fun! You're either locking your planeswalkers out of the game until you get rid of the shield and do all of their ultimates, or just locking all of your opponents planeswalkers out of the game?
Our sadness is because instead of the P9 which we were all clamoring for we got duals which we already had and in some cases spent quite a bit on. so we didn't get what we want and what we already had lost value.
And duals weren't the bottleneck... anyone who wanted to play could have easily obtained the ones they need. most decks require 6-7 duals and a bunch of fetches. Doesn't come close to the price of 4x FoW.
So oeverall this is still a net postive for legacy/classic as it will get more players... but the hardcore Classic players all had their hopes up for p9.
I dabbled in Magic from time to time but the first set I opened in bulk (drafting) was Ravnica. I remember the first shock land I opened was Sacred Foundry. This was both exciting for me (as it was worth I believe near 15 tickets) but also pretty boring because it was a land. I feel the same way about this issue today. Having chase lands is very boring. I've always wanted to branch out into other formats from but dual lands would be the last thing I would ever want to buy because they don't do anything. Sure, they fix your mana and are almost needed for some of those formats but they're the most boring type of cards to own. Since I don't own any of the duals, this will be good for me. Maybe I will crack a few from drafting ME4 and then I will have incentive to buy the remaining lands. Lowering the price of them would also convince me to join a legacy/classic event and getting players into these events (as mentioned above) would be a great thing as they don't always fire. The ultimate MED4 would have the Dual Lands, FOW, and Power 9, making nearly everyone happy. But we got what we got.
There is definitely an elitist divide between those who want to encourage new blood and those who like being able to play with expensive cards not many others have. But also some people probably look at those cards as an investment which in this case has just become a situation where they either panic sell now or hold and hope it rises again so that if they do want to get out at sometime they still can afford to.
Some event prize structures encourage this type of attitude. It's really kind of sad.
The weekend challenges in particular encourage the player base to get just enough players to make it fire, but every player after the minimum number simply dilutes the prizes. This gets really hairy with the top 8 style of events where people are always losing out on prizes due to tiebreaker points. Not to mention that a 6+ hour tournament with a top 8 play-off is not the mostly friendly type of environment for a new player.
These are the main reasons I don't really like the weekend challenges. I'm in the minority in this opinion, but that's because the prizes are crazy good with a 24 people turn-out.
I want growth in the classic based formats, specifically 100 singleton, but some players just seem interested in farming the weekend challenges for all they're worth.
Without FOWs reprints, the overall cost is not going to change anyway. For every dollar you save on the duals, FOWs is going to sky rocket. Especially, if new players are introduced.
>>Berserk - not reprinted. Still only available from FTV: E.<<
And the early ME sets.
A guy can always dream right?
I'm with LE on this one, I currently don't have the duals because I sold them all, but a couple weeks ago I did have them and I still would feel the same about the reprint
I just don't understand this way of thinking. Those who own the duals are the ones who play Classic and Legacy. And surely they want more new faces joining their ranks. And when some expensive cards get reprinted and become available to the masses, they become... sad? Really?
You can't say "Hey join Legacy it's so much fun!" and then get sad because more people will be able to join Legacy. That's absurd!
Or do I get it all wrong? Do they want to be left alone? Do they want that Legacy and Classic remain as a "Club for the Privileged"? If that's the case, then yeah, today is definitely a bad day.
But otherwise they should be happy that at least some of the cards that prevent people from playing Legacy will be available to more players. More affordable cards = more new faces. And that's a good thing, right?
LE
It seems that it depends on which side of the fence you are on when it comes to the reprint of the Duals. IF you already have them, you are sad, while those who don't have them or the ones they need are happy to see a reprint.
Yep, I'm bummed >.<
I'm happy to see Atog at common for pauper affinity decks.
Conversion - Rare, why? The original was uncommon and it's just as bad. I don't like setting fire to four dollars.
Leeches - Rare. At least you won't see this card often in draft. That's good because it can't be used in a draft of this set: zero poison creatures.
It seems like each color has 2-3 rares that will see play after the draft is over, most of which are restricted. The other colored rares are junk. The Lands color is the big winner; maze, 10 duals, workshop.
Except for Balance and Armageddon, the white rares are universally horrible.
Green has fastbond and regrowth.
Red has Wheel and Fork.
Black has Sinkhole, tutor, and a few kitchen table fun cards (hordes, word of command).
Blue has Stasis and Serendib.
Berserk - not reprinted. Still only available from FTV: E.
Sorrow's Path - not reprinted. We can be thankful for that.
ME4 will be great for the casual Legacy/Classic players because of the reprinting of the dual lands. If the power 9 was reprinted, I doubt they would leave them unbanned in 100 singleton or classic tribal. I think this will be great for 100 singleton because it will lower the main cost of entry into the format for any deck other than mono-colored weenie decks.
I must admit that this is pretty bad news for tournament spikes who want classic to turn into Vintage.
Never will see the ante cards I am afraid.
Everything I wanted to see here was here and more, personally I feel this set seems a lot better then the previous MEs, but I agree after seeing the reprint of the dual lands it seems a mistake to have left FoW off
my wish list for ME5: Jeweled Bird ggkthx
Stasis: players don't have an untap step
Seedborn Muse: untap your permanents during each other players' untap
In other words, the "combo" doesn't work.
Stasis + Forsaken City works
Stasis + Mind Over Matter works
Stasis + BoP + Instill Energy works (same set, barring the Birds)
Stasis + Chronatog works
Add Root Maze, Frozen AEther or Loxodon Gatekeeper to any of these to complete the lock.
Best thing to happen for me on MTGO, original art Sengir Vampire and Demonic Tutor. Cannot wait.
2 weeks ago I got 3x Ajani Vengeant here for 15 so its really off.
Gave a version of it a try, amongst other tweaks, I put in eternal witness and nim deathmantle. The nim deathmantle combined with the sac outlet is just a great little combo to begin with, and used it for much fun and profit with terrastodon and the yavimaya dryad, but nothing beat recurring damnation over and over with eternal witness.
BTW, how did you change your MTGO screen appearance from the default?
Etriol, Reaper9889, and ArchGenius: thanks for contributing! See me online for your Pauper Commander sets.
I'm excited for this. I am going to draft this set a lot, something I've never done for a master's edition set before. I've wanted to get into legacy for a while and hopefully this set will be what can ease the pain of getting the duals.
Also, there is something wrong with your Ajani Vengeant data because I'm pretty sure at no time last week was he trading for 20 tickets. If anything, I'd say he gained about a ticket to hit the 7.50 mark. And if you look at his price chart there is clearly something wrong there.
Yup, I noticed that, too.. No way to destroy enchantments. So watch out, I'm gonna ping you with Warp Artifact and finish you off with Cyclone!
Ok. I have no problem with them reprinting duals. It helps players get into the format. I am trying to reenter the format after a 2 year hiatus. Last night I picked up a pair of tropical islands for 20 each and daze for 8 each (before i heard about the reprinting). This set will help me out.
Now that being said....WHY WASNT FOW REPRINTED? So that want a bunch of new players for legacy but at the moment have to spend $300 on a playset of FOW's if they can find them. WOTC must want FOW to hit $150. If they had reprinted FOW this would of been a homerun for the new player looking to get into legacy.
The example of Baneslayer reprinting is really not accurate. Right now Baneslayer Angel has no real deck. I think that is the reason for the low cost now. If tomorrow the best deck in standard had Baneslayer Angel in it then you would see the price climb and climb. The duals on the other hand are used in every deck. SO their playability will never be a factor. I think and this is my opinion only...Undergournd Sea will be $30, Tundra and Tropical Island $20. The rest around $9-$12.
P.S. I really want sinkhole!
wooooo leeches
take that infect...
sorta
cuz erryone runnin legacy infect
praps useful against skittles in edh though.
Yeah mox mirror is broken beyond broken. In fact, I don't even think manacraft works within the rules? How does the game state know whether or not you could have made a land drop?
I think the first one is actually fairly reasonable, except that it's absolutely no fun! You're either locking your planeswalkers out of the game until you get rid of the shield and do all of their ultimates, or just locking all of your opponents planeswalkers out of the game?