I've enjoyed all of your articles thus far. I like your concise, well-organized style. Keep 'em coming.
One note: going forward, the newest set is always drafted first. For Scars block, we'll draft in MBS-SoM-SoM order. The implications of this don't matter to the scope of your article (value in Limited); I just mention it for accuracy.
I echo the sentiment on wanting more buybots from MTGOtraders. I often will look to the lone bot only to see it occupied, and then having to go elsewhere. Maybe they prefer lower volume and get most of their stock through buying collections?
While there are a lot more infect cards in besieged than scars, it's still only one pack of three. More importantly, it's the first pack! I suspect that we'll be reading a lot of draft recaps soon where multiple people go into infect from pack 1 (MBS), where it is deep enough for this to happen. In packs 2-3, there are then going to be more people trying to pick up infect than is really plausible from the SoM packs (which support 2-(maybe)3 players usually).
This is the main reason I rate blightwidow as probably my favourite common in MBS. It's a good infect guy, but it doesn't lock you into playing infect, as it's also awesome in pretty much any G/x archetype. Also, it blocks flesh-eater imp successfully, no matter how many random creatures they have lying around!
I think it's going to sell poorly online, though. Think of the difference between a paper $130 Xiahou Dun, the One-Eyed and his online counterpart at 12 cents. Progenitus would be sweet since he's over 10 tickets. I'm not sure how many high ticket Commanders are online, actually. =/ Compounding matters is that the online supply is virtually limitless, making already cheap and easy-to-find cards more so.
Wasn't there a Worlds where one of the final matches was two control players with 10+ mana both in topdeck mode? I remember it because they both topdecked Jace and then the 2/2 creating Zombie guy in subsequent turns.
"Well yes, Preator's Counsel is my favorite Green card of the set. If only I knew why..."
It's because you can tell how good Preator's Counsel is going to be for Commander. You get all the cards in your graveyard back in you hand (including all those fetch lands and mana acceleration spells) then to top it off, you don't have a maximum hand size for the rest of the game! There isn't even a blue card (that I know of) that has the second effect. I just about fell off my chair, even Consecrated Sphinx will eventually force you to "use it or lose it" when it comes to your hand.
not sure about that top deck example :). Yes it is lotus cobra but one mana expensive and can be countered by negate and spell pierce. i am not saying it is a bad card. just saying it will not make a big impact.
I am playing a lot of mono Blue Architect these days WITH MBS cards and my playtesting shows that the Thopter is actually quite good in that deck. For my big spells section of the deck, I'm testing the Thopter, the Battlesphere and Spine of Ish Sah (leaving Wurmcoil in the sideboard) and so far these three (seems to) work great together.
I also test Thopter in my UB Tezzeret deck instead of Wurmcoil Engine, and the results are also very nice. There are only a few spells in Block that can kill that creature instantly and that means that I will have 5 nice targets for Tezz the next turn (which then turn into 5/5 flyers one by one).
All in all, I can say that I really like Thopter Assembly.
I've seen Green Sun's Zenith in action. It's an excellent spell. Consider this: You are in the top deck mode and you draw a Summoning Trap while you have, say, eight lands in play. Is there a guarantee that it will give you something game-winning? Of course not. It may even get you a mere Lotus Cobra or sometimes even nothing. But if you draw Green Sun's Zenith at that time with eight lands in play, it is 100% guaranteed that you will get yourself your LONE copy of Avenger of Zendikar.
It is also a great card during early turns because it's a Lotus Cobra at worst and that's a very important creature for the deck.
i think green sun's zenith is overrated (by everyone). I prefer summoning trap any day. First it is a sorcery, second it is discarded to inquision of kozilek, third it is expensive for the cards you really want to tutor for.
I agree on thopter assembly. I like to think of it as having anti-haste. Precursor golem comes down and the next turn it swings for 9. Thopter assembly comes down, then the next turn it becomes 5 thopters, then the turn after that it swings for 5.
I don't really get why that would be better than any of the other big artifact finishers (wurmcoil, battlesphere, or golem).
On the subject of precursor golem, I saw a pretty funny casual-constructed game involving him a few days ago. The golems controller cast tainted strike on him, and attacked for 12 poison, but during the declare blocks phase his opponent cast burn the impure on it, and dealt him a lethal 9-damage! Larks.
Good article, but I disagree with you on Thopter Assembly. How is Thopter Assembly a good replacement for Precursor Golem? Thopter Assembly is slow, can be easily killed off by Oxxida Scrapmelter and Viridian Corrupter while Precursor Golem only loses one golem that way. Precursor also has combos with Venser and Twisted Image. Precursor still costs 1 less than Thopter Assembly. In most cases I'd take Myr Battlesphere, Wurmcoil Engine, and Precusor Golem over Thopter Assembly.
Huzzah, it means a lot that you guys want us to succeed. Personally I have had a blast doing the first and second cast, and am optimistic that we will have inertia as our 2nd one clocked in at 72 mins b4 editing, jeez.
Also Lion's Eye Diamond really confuses me. Usaly these old cards only rise when there is a reason. such as a new deck, new b and r anouncment, or it just becomes hot in the paper world.
Classic- almost unplayed as a 4 of.
O Legacy- havent seen a ton of it prizing
p Legacy- not doing a lot of work here either.
Your response to me is probably better than the original article ;) I'm guessing that English isn't your native tongue, and in some cases I'm not sure I understand what you're saying and in some cases I don't think you understood me.
At any rate, so your theme is supposed to be "overlooked" cards for classic pauper? Ok, that's fine. But there's literally thousands of such cards, and it's still not clear why you picked these three. Guardian of the Guildpact isn't even overlooked, everybody knows about him, and he has been used successfully in competitive decks.
Your assertion that these cards are viable cards for "Tier 1" decks is at this point an unsupported assertion. Trying to encourage people to play cards that have been overlooked is a laudable goal, but cards are not played in a vacuum. You have to give people some context, meaning the combos or interactions or decks where the card might be useful. If you hope for these cards to be used more competitively then you should be telling us a new use for these cards, but you barely covered the known uses, much less reveal anything we didn't already know.
Let's look again at Sprout Swarm. It's an interesting card. But in your article you said nothing interesting about it, and in your comment, you said, "Sprout Swarm is definitely not the best out for infinite combos." And then you didn't explain any further. Well I don't know if it is or if it isn't, but there's only a handful of infinite combos in pauper, and I'm not sure any of them are any good. In my own opinion, the Sprout Swarm combo is closer to being useful than the other infinite combos. But you still haven't explained to your dear readers how to go infinite with the card in the first place.
But more importantly, why should anybody care? It generates 1/1 tokens, people get that. But generally, there are better ways to make tokens. What makes Sprout Swarm more interesting than other token generators? So it has buyback, but so does Lab Rats. Those are really expensive tokens, what good are they? Mogg War Marshal, Dragon Fodder, Kuldotha Rebirth, Raise the Alarm, the Eldrazi Spawn cards, and others are all better cards generally. There's two aspects to Sprout Swarm that bear closer scrutiny: Sprout Swarm generates Saprolings, and it has Convoke. Saprolings have some interesting properties, and might combine well with Proliferate. Convoke is what allows you to pump out a massive army of guys and is the reason you don't have to wait until turn 5.
So what are you going to do with your tokens? Play an RG Raid Bombardment deck? The other more efficient token generators will leave little room for Sprout Swarm, and besides attacking and convoking don't go well together. Where Sprout Swarm gets interesting is in a BG Sacrifice deck, with Carrion Feeder and Deathspore Thallid. There's really no point in talking about Sprout Swarm unless you mention Nettle Sentinel, Carrion Feeder/Nantuko Husk/Bloodthrone Vampire/etc, Thallids in general, and Deathspore Thallid in particular. These are the cards that really have a chance to take advantage of Sprout Swarm.
On to Guardian of the Guildpact. At 4cc, you have to work hard to make Guardian relevant. There are a few ways to make Guardian relevant: 1) ramp, 2) Armadillo Cloak, 3) Pestilence, 4) exalted. Your original article said, "Also, Armadillo Cloak." That was all the insight you gave on these important topics. One of the problems with Guardian, aside from being 4cc, is the prevalence of Agony Warp and artifact creatures, with Affinity being one of the top 3 decks right now. He is a good way to stop Atog, however. A WG Guardian/Cloak/Pridemage deck with a little mana ramping should have good game against affinity and have a reasonable game against goblins.
The Pestilence deck must use Dark Ritual to mana ramp, and uses Wall of Hope to keep ahead in life when using Pestilence. The en-Kor creatures in combination with Order of Leitbur also work well with Pestilence in a WB setting. In addition, there are lots of good WB cards that a Guardian/Pestilence deck can leverage.
As for Train of Thought, it's competing with all the blue draw spells, including Oona's Grace. And there are lots of draw spells. Train of Thought is very mana intensive. You have to have a LOT of mana for it to be any better than the other draw cards. This is why people don't use it much; generally there's just better ways to draw cards. True, the Replicate makes it harder to counter the card draw, but if you're playing this card, you're playing blue already, and you are probably doing the countering, not the other way around. If it only required colorless mana to replicate, then it would be more like a common Braingeyser, and it would see play, but Post decks don't have enough blue mana to take advantage of it. Foresee, Think Twice, Oona's Grace, Deep Analysis, and others set a pretty high bar, so the application for Train of Thought is very narrow. The best use I ever came up with was for the killing blow with Jace's Erasure. But even so, the draw/discard cards tend to work better with Jace's Erasure. The problem is that it's a sorcery. So even when you have the mana to make it worthwhile, it's hard to spend the mana, and early in the game, it sucks compared to the other draw cards. Comparing it to draw spells that nobody uses doesn't make a very compelling case.
Anyway, I just expect that if somebody gets paid to write an article, they should do better than I can in five minutes off the top of my head. I didn't get paid to write this comment. I don't want people to think that pauper has a lower standard.
If you want to write an article like this, here's my suggestion. Plan on writing a series of articles: 1 for each color, one for artifacts, one for lands, and one for multi-colored cards. Then for each article pick 10 overlooked cards, including at least 1 creature, 1 instant, 1 sorcery, and 1 enchantment, including some low CMC and some high CMC cards. For each card, explain what makes it interesting, what makes it unique, deserving of our attention. Discuss how you might use it, what cards it will combine with in interesting ways. Without a deck listing, describe a deck that might use it. That would be an article.
Hi AJ - I should have been aware of the computer issues from Freed from the Reel. Ill hold on to for you, once you are back up and running please add buddy "Eternal_Hammer" and we can do the exchange.
- Good luck getting the PC fixed!
I'm currently stuck on a 2003-vintage laptop which is unable to run the client. We can either wait 'til my main machine gets fixed, or I could nominate someone to hold the prize on my behalf until then.
Congratulations to our winner AJ the answer is 37. We already recorded episode 2 prior to your answer so will need to insert an errata in the text of the article.
I will find you in client with the prize.
I've enjoyed all of your articles thus far. I like your concise, well-organized style. Keep 'em coming.
One note: going forward, the newest set is always drafted first. For Scars block, we'll draft in MBS-SoM-SoM order. The implications of this don't matter to the scope of your article (value in Limited); I just mention it for accuracy.
I echo the sentiment on wanting more buybots from MTGOtraders. I often will look to the lone bot only to see it occupied, and then having to go elsewhere. Maybe they prefer lower volume and get most of their stock through buying collections?
Again, great article. See you in the q's!
While there are a lot more infect cards in besieged than scars, it's still only one pack of three. More importantly, it's the first pack! I suspect that we'll be reading a lot of draft recaps soon where multiple people go into infect from pack 1 (MBS), where it is deep enough for this to happen. In packs 2-3, there are then going to be more people trying to pick up infect than is really plausible from the SoM packs (which support 2-(maybe)3 players usually).
This is the main reason I rate blightwidow as probably my favourite common in MBS. It's a good infect guy, but it doesn't lock you into playing infect, as it's also awesome in pretty much any G/x archetype. Also, it blocks flesh-eater imp successfully, no matter how many random creatures they have lying around!
...point. To be fair, it's been a long while since I could check the list in the client.
that would obviously have been this years worlds since those cards you mentioned werent available before now...
I think it's going to sell poorly online, though. Think of the difference between a paper $130 Xiahou Dun, the One-Eyed and his online counterpart at 12 cents. Progenitus would be sweet since he's over 10 tickets. I'm not sure how many high ticket Commanders are online, actually. =/ Compounding matters is that the online supply is virtually limitless, making already cheap and easy-to-find cards more so.
Wasn't there a Worlds where one of the final matches was two control players with 10+ mana both in topdeck mode? I remember it because they both topdecked Jace and then the 2/2 creating Zombie guy in subsequent turns.
Pheldagriff
Kiki-Jiki
Progenitus
Zur, the Enchanter
Just a few.
I am not saying they should be, but I wouldn't be surprised to them.
I think this set will be expensive as it will really apeal to Commander players.
Apart from Reserve List issues regarding Rofellos, I don't think it or Braids will be in FTV: Legends since they're banned in Commander.
AJ, I don't think you want to pick up Workshops for Tribal unless you don't want to follow the whole Legacy transition of that format.
"Well yes, Preator's Counsel is my favorite Green card of the set. If only I knew why..."
It's because you can tell how good Preator's Counsel is going to be for Commander. You get all the cards in your graveyard back in you hand (including all those fetch lands and mana acceleration spells) then to top it off, you don't have a maximum hand size for the rest of the game! There isn't even a blue card (that I know of) that has the second effect. I just about fell off my chair, even Consecrated Sphinx will eventually force you to "use it or lose it" when it comes to your hand.
not sure about that top deck example :). Yes it is lotus cobra but one mana expensive and can be countered by negate and spell pierce. i am not saying it is a bad card. just saying it will not make a big impact.
I cannot believe I read that entire thing and did not pick that up, foolish me.
Lord erman, consider this.. "you have eight mana and are in topdeck mode"... you don't deserve to win !
edit: almost forgot; solid article
The 3rd most placing Legacy deck is Storm with LEDs, 2nd is Countertop and Zoo at 1st.
Thanks for the comments.
I am playing a lot of mono Blue Architect these days WITH MBS cards and my playtesting shows that the Thopter is actually quite good in that deck. For my big spells section of the deck, I'm testing the Thopter, the Battlesphere and Spine of Ish Sah (leaving Wurmcoil in the sideboard) and so far these three (seems to) work great together.
I also test Thopter in my UB Tezzeret deck instead of Wurmcoil Engine, and the results are also very nice. There are only a few spells in Block that can kill that creature instantly and that means that I will have 5 nice targets for Tezz the next turn (which then turn into 5/5 flyers one by one).
All in all, I can say that I really like Thopter Assembly.
I've seen Green Sun's Zenith in action. It's an excellent spell. Consider this: You are in the top deck mode and you draw a Summoning Trap while you have, say, eight lands in play. Is there a guarantee that it will give you something game-winning? Of course not. It may even get you a mere Lotus Cobra or sometimes even nothing. But if you draw Green Sun's Zenith at that time with eight lands in play, it is 100% guaranteed that you will get yourself your LONE copy of Avenger of Zendikar.
It is also a great card during early turns because it's a Lotus Cobra at worst and that's a very important creature for the deck.
Thanks again for the comments.
LE
i think green sun's zenith is overrated (by everyone). I prefer summoning trap any day. First it is a sorcery, second it is discarded to inquision of kozilek, third it is expensive for the cards you really want to tutor for.
I agree on thopter assembly. I like to think of it as having anti-haste. Precursor golem comes down and the next turn it swings for 9. Thopter assembly comes down, then the next turn it becomes 5 thopters, then the turn after that it swings for 5.
I don't really get why that would be better than any of the other big artifact finishers (wurmcoil, battlesphere, or golem).
On the subject of precursor golem, I saw a pretty funny casual-constructed game involving him a few days ago. The golems controller cast tainted strike on him, and attacked for 12 poison, but during the declare blocks phase his opponent cast burn the impure on it, and dealt him a lethal 9-damage! Larks.
Sorry, this article is about Standard Pauper. No Brainstorms around. ;)
All we can do is play Foresees and Preordains while exploiting Skyfishers and Oracles.
Good article, but I disagree with you on Thopter Assembly. How is Thopter Assembly a good replacement for Precursor Golem? Thopter Assembly is slow, can be easily killed off by Oxxida Scrapmelter and Viridian Corrupter while Precursor Golem only loses one golem that way. Precursor also has combos with Venser and Twisted Image. Precursor still costs 1 less than Thopter Assembly. In most cases I'd take Myr Battlesphere, Wurmcoil Engine, and Precusor Golem over Thopter Assembly.
It's all good. With luck and a fair wind, it shouldn't be too long...
Huzzah, it means a lot that you guys want us to succeed. Personally I have had a blast doing the first and second cast, and am optimistic that we will have inertia as our 2nd one clocked in at 72 mins b4 editing, jeez.
Also Lion's Eye Diamond really confuses me. Usaly these old cards only rise when there is a reason. such as a new deck, new b and r anouncment, or it just becomes hot in the paper world.
Classic- almost unplayed as a 4 of.
O Legacy- havent seen a ton of it prizing
p Legacy- not doing a lot of work here either.
Your response to me is probably better than the original article ;) I'm guessing that English isn't your native tongue, and in some cases I'm not sure I understand what you're saying and in some cases I don't think you understood me.
At any rate, so your theme is supposed to be "overlooked" cards for classic pauper? Ok, that's fine. But there's literally thousands of such cards, and it's still not clear why you picked these three. Guardian of the Guildpact isn't even overlooked, everybody knows about him, and he has been used successfully in competitive decks.
Your assertion that these cards are viable cards for "Tier 1" decks is at this point an unsupported assertion. Trying to encourage people to play cards that have been overlooked is a laudable goal, but cards are not played in a vacuum. You have to give people some context, meaning the combos or interactions or decks where the card might be useful. If you hope for these cards to be used more competitively then you should be telling us a new use for these cards, but you barely covered the known uses, much less reveal anything we didn't already know.
Let's look again at Sprout Swarm. It's an interesting card. But in your article you said nothing interesting about it, and in your comment, you said, "Sprout Swarm is definitely not the best out for infinite combos." And then you didn't explain any further. Well I don't know if it is or if it isn't, but there's only a handful of infinite combos in pauper, and I'm not sure any of them are any good. In my own opinion, the Sprout Swarm combo is closer to being useful than the other infinite combos. But you still haven't explained to your dear readers how to go infinite with the card in the first place.
But more importantly, why should anybody care? It generates 1/1 tokens, people get that. But generally, there are better ways to make tokens. What makes Sprout Swarm more interesting than other token generators? So it has buyback, but so does Lab Rats. Those are really expensive tokens, what good are they? Mogg War Marshal, Dragon Fodder, Kuldotha Rebirth, Raise the Alarm, the Eldrazi Spawn cards, and others are all better cards generally. There's two aspects to Sprout Swarm that bear closer scrutiny: Sprout Swarm generates Saprolings, and it has Convoke. Saprolings have some interesting properties, and might combine well with Proliferate. Convoke is what allows you to pump out a massive army of guys and is the reason you don't have to wait until turn 5.
So what are you going to do with your tokens? Play an RG Raid Bombardment deck? The other more efficient token generators will leave little room for Sprout Swarm, and besides attacking and convoking don't go well together. Where Sprout Swarm gets interesting is in a BG Sacrifice deck, with Carrion Feeder and Deathspore Thallid. There's really no point in talking about Sprout Swarm unless you mention Nettle Sentinel, Carrion Feeder/Nantuko Husk/Bloodthrone Vampire/etc, Thallids in general, and Deathspore Thallid in particular. These are the cards that really have a chance to take advantage of Sprout Swarm.
On to Guardian of the Guildpact. At 4cc, you have to work hard to make Guardian relevant. There are a few ways to make Guardian relevant: 1) ramp, 2) Armadillo Cloak, 3) Pestilence, 4) exalted. Your original article said, "Also, Armadillo Cloak." That was all the insight you gave on these important topics. One of the problems with Guardian, aside from being 4cc, is the prevalence of Agony Warp and artifact creatures, with Affinity being one of the top 3 decks right now. He is a good way to stop Atog, however. A WG Guardian/Cloak/Pridemage deck with a little mana ramping should have good game against affinity and have a reasonable game against goblins.
The Pestilence deck must use Dark Ritual to mana ramp, and uses Wall of Hope to keep ahead in life when using Pestilence. The en-Kor creatures in combination with Order of Leitbur also work well with Pestilence in a WB setting. In addition, there are lots of good WB cards that a Guardian/Pestilence deck can leverage.
As for Train of Thought, it's competing with all the blue draw spells, including Oona's Grace. And there are lots of draw spells. Train of Thought is very mana intensive. You have to have a LOT of mana for it to be any better than the other draw cards. This is why people don't use it much; generally there's just better ways to draw cards. True, the Replicate makes it harder to counter the card draw, but if you're playing this card, you're playing blue already, and you are probably doing the countering, not the other way around. If it only required colorless mana to replicate, then it would be more like a common Braingeyser, and it would see play, but Post decks don't have enough blue mana to take advantage of it. Foresee, Think Twice, Oona's Grace, Deep Analysis, and others set a pretty high bar, so the application for Train of Thought is very narrow. The best use I ever came up with was for the killing blow with Jace's Erasure. But even so, the draw/discard cards tend to work better with Jace's Erasure. The problem is that it's a sorcery. So even when you have the mana to make it worthwhile, it's hard to spend the mana, and early in the game, it sucks compared to the other draw cards. Comparing it to draw spells that nobody uses doesn't make a very compelling case.
Anyway, I just expect that if somebody gets paid to write an article, they should do better than I can in five minutes off the top of my head. I didn't get paid to write this comment. I don't want people to think that pauper has a lower standard.
If you want to write an article like this, here's my suggestion. Plan on writing a series of articles: 1 for each color, one for artifacts, one for lands, and one for multi-colored cards. Then for each article pick 10 overlooked cards, including at least 1 creature, 1 instant, 1 sorcery, and 1 enchantment, including some low CMC and some high CMC cards. For each card, explain what makes it interesting, what makes it unique, deserving of our attention. Discuss how you might use it, what cards it will combine with in interesting ways. Without a deck listing, describe a deck that might use it. That would be an article.
Hi AJ - I should have been aware of the computer issues from Freed from the Reel. Ill hold on to for you, once you are back up and running please add buddy "Eternal_Hammer" and we can do the exchange.
- Good luck getting the PC fixed!
I'm currently stuck on a 2003-vintage laptop which is unable to run the client. We can either wait 'til my main machine gets fixed, or I could nominate someone to hold the prize on my behalf until then.
Congratulations to our winner AJ the answer is 37. We already recorded episode 2 prior to your answer so will need to insert an errata in the text of the article.
I will find you in client with the prize.