Im not sure Id call it a 9-day wonder. I interviewed Sol at PTNY that year and it seemed like he was developing new variants on it constantly that were doing fairly well. Also since then many, many other sub archetypes have sprung up. If it was an actual 9-day wonder no one would remember it now.
Unfortunately the White Aggro deck isn't under $5, it comes to $4.36 plus some cards I added to my budget collection over the last couple of weeks (as part of the article I'm tracking it cumulatively) it'll come to about $10-12 from scratch, but if the other decks don't say "excluding cards from my collection" then that's the total cost of the deck from scratch.
It's just because the article is half about presenting super-cheap Standard decks, and also picking one to go forward with, but most of the lists I'll be featuring you can pick up for under $5 from scratch, and none will break the bank!
Turbofog's always been a favourite of mine, and that Curse deck just looks like too much fun to pass up!
If you do start writing again soon I look forward to being able to read your articles!
I promise I'm gonna be writing about budget building again soon. But dang, you and Boosh are doing such a good job at it too. Maybe we'll have a trinity of budget on PureMTGO. :P
Loved the lists, definitely want to see some playtesting. I'm actually surprised at the White Aggro being under $5, but Hero of Bladehold is indeed a card that would crank this deck from about 6 all the way up to 11! :P Unfortunately, the price would go from 2 all the way up to 11!!!
Curse.dec is something I've always wanted to run, but never got around to brewing a full list. I might use your list as a springboard soon. :)
UG Turbofog is also awesome, I've always loved these Turbofog decks. Kinda makes me wish we didn't have to wait until February for Simic's return to Standard in Gatecrash. I think around then, I'll see how Turbofog fares with SOM Block and M12 cycled out.
Got to see the Riders theme deck in action when we teamed up in some impromptu 2hg tribal wars yesterday. The samurai guy with Basilisk Collar is sick, although less impressive against somebody who just has mutavaults for blockers most of the game.
If I'd remembered your post about your own kaleidoscope deck, I'd have suggested we duel those! We'll have to team 'em up in some 2hg some time.
The name of the deck has nothing to do with rocks or stones. The name comes from a deck that Sol Malka used to play that was named "The Rock and His Millions" and named after Dwayne Johnson, AKA The Rock. The signature card of the deck was Phyrexian Plaguelord. The deck was something of a nine days wonder and the name stuck for green/black decks.
Sol still plays once in a while. Back in the day, he was a real grinder and wrote a lot of good articles on the 'net.
I always enjoy your modern stuff Blippy, but the backgrounds in the deck lists make them hard to read. The two death cloud ones are not too bad, but the fae one is tough to read some of the cards.
thanks! I have to admit that I am too, there is a lot to talk about and it is mostly going to have a focus on competitive play... trying my best to have that ready to go for two weeks for now, but could be tight
That's exactly what I'm trying to do, rise above statistical variation by gathering a large data set. I also used to think that the variation was way higher than other formats, but I've found that I can usually get 2-1, even with a bad pool by squeezing every edge I can. We'll have to wait to see if this pans out, but so far my data supports the fact that someone can consistently beat 50% with solid play.
As for the EV of each pack opened, that data will be available in my forthcoming article. Having looked at the numbers, it would be impossible to go infinite at 50% win rate, I would say that it looks like 60-66% is what you will need to go infinite.
I'm looking forward to your Introduction to the Pauper format. I would like to venture into this format, but with such a large card pool and endless options...its hard to decide which deep end of the pool to jump into?
Not really sure how I missed Trading Post's goodness. Looks like a card to pick up four of. It was great to hear all 3 of you back together again. Hope this is a more regular occurrence. I didn't end up playing the pre-release events despite the lowered cost but I did see BKibler crash and burn with his sealed decks in them.
Happy that Niv is coming back. Looks like draw matters again. :D
#1 - Glad to have yall back!
#2 - I've said since I really got into Magic that Wizards doesn't really care about eternal formats because they get so much more money off of new sets... old cards is all secondary market money
#3 - I think the tourney is a great idea esp trying to work rounds for those who can't put in hours in one day to do it... one of the holds for "new" people joining those who already join the classic PREs would be cost as everyone always says... you get this feel that its like FoW or you can't compete, tho maybe its just a lack of info on the format for those who are interested, but have never been down that path
I played against a UB control deck kind of like this in my most recent daily (on the 29th), but it also used undying evil for the wicked combination with evoked mulldrifter. Spending 4 mana for 4 cards and a 3/3 flyer at the end of it is pretty gamebreaking!
A couple of list errors Affinity Shops should have 4 signal pests not 3 listed, and Aristocratic Acts of Artistry should have 6 spells listed, and 30 creatures listed.
4 Dimir Aqueduct
7 Island
7 Swamp
2 Terramorphic Expanse
4 Chittering Rats
4 Delver of Secrets
3 Mulldrifter
3 Ninja of the Deep Hours
4 Phantasmal Bear
4 Ravenous Rats
3 Agony Warp
4 Brainstorm
3 Disfigure
2 Duress
3 Funeral Charm
1 Recoil
2 Snap
SB:
1 Deep Analysis
1 Disfigure
2 Duress
4 Echoing Decay
2 Mana Leak
1 Mulldrifter
1 Ninja of the Deep Hours
3 Snuff Out
This player favors Preordain over Brainstorm, and uses a 3/4th playset of Funeral Charms. Theres a couple differences in the creature lineup between your decklist and his, but on the whole, I think he (or she) is working towards the same idea.
The article is interesting, but I think the idea of evaluating the EV for 4-pack sealed using individual performance is inherently flawed. The format has a notoriously high level of luck, and opening cards like bonfire of the damned both shoots your profits high while also making it much easier to go 3-0 due to the ridiculously broken power of the card. A more sensible way to evalute the EV for a format is to calculate the EV for opening an average pack, multiply that by 4, assume a win percent of 50%, subtract the current cost of packs, and adding the value of packs you would win assuming average results. Of course, the EV for a format varies as the value of the cards and packs change, so this calculation is only good for a particular moment in time. Once you know the typical EV, you can adjust that better fit you personally if you believe your skill is better (or worse) than average. Any EV results based on individual performance are relatively meaningless, unless you are playing so many games that you are able to rise above statistical variation.
New accounts will now include "New Player" tickets. These tickets will be used in 4-player, 2 match tournaments that will fire when there is enough people to play in the Limited Queues Room. The current product is M13 for these events though it will, I'm sure, change with each new core set. Each win will grant you 3 points and players with 6 points receive a copy of the promo card from that week's TNMO.
I'm going to do my best to keep adding updates for this article... at least until a time where the new client comes out...
I only read your first sentence and then I got angry. There's no functional difference between the two. We can't have a conversation if you're willing to insult me and then act like you didn't mean it that way. No one ever takes the exact meaning of your words as you meant them. They'll take them as they find them. If someone finds your word choice inappropriate, that's on you, not the person reading.
How's this for a reasonable demand? I want everyone to treat each other with respect. As long as that doesn't happen, I can't/won't play magic. Wizards doesn't respect me as a customer enough to make a client that doesn't break down every five minutes. Other players don't respect me to understand that this is a game, not a drug addiction where the only point is to get your high by beating someone with the strongest deck you have. There are far too many reasons for me to stay away and not enough for me to stay in.
I'm already working on getting a comparison of the EV of packs ready for this weeks article; check back in a couple days.
As for analyzing the differences that limited environments have on my win/loss rates, I think that is a fantastic idea, but I don't have enough data for the results to be anywhere close to statistically significant. Don't worry, though! I am keeping copious records of the formats I play in, so in a couple weeks, this should be a feature of the column.
Opening my account last week and seeing my collection gone was a bit unsettling, but after I went into the help room and saw it wasn't just me, I calmed down real quick. The thing I found amusing was how so many players kept complaining and complaining even after the ORC said "We're working on it." As awesome as MTGO is, it's still just a computer system run by humans. Mistakes happen.
I disagree with you saying the R/G/b is the defining deck in Block right now. The best deck is more of a 4 color green build with access to the best cards in the format. You really can't tell where Jund ends and Naya begins these days. but I do agree that the format has been solved.
Personally, I like the new format for TNMO. I don't have enough cards to play in all the formats (I'm really surprised that they offer Legacy and Modern), and don't have to spend the tix for a 6 pack M12 sealed just to get a promo card. But I would spend 5 tix to play in the same 6 pack phantom sealed event for the promo card. I think that changing TNMO to attract more new players is a good thing.
I ever won was because of Sol Malka's rock deck. Deranged Hermit, Plaguelord, man, that is when Magic was Magic :D
Im not sure Id call it a 9-day wonder. I interviewed Sol at PTNY that year and it seemed like he was developing new variants on it constantly that were doing fairly well. Also since then many, many other sub archetypes have sprung up. If it was an actual 9-day wonder no one would remember it now.
Anytime you're on feel free to hit me up for 2hg though be warned I am not always actually available. :D 2hg tribal is way more fun for me than 1v1.
Oh and regarding those mutavaults I might make a slightly less friendly version with 2 life from the loams and 3 wastelands.
Hey, thanks for the comment!
Unfortunately the White Aggro deck isn't under $5, it comes to $4.36 plus some cards I added to my budget collection over the last couple of weeks (as part of the article I'm tracking it cumulatively) it'll come to about $10-12 from scratch, but if the other decks don't say "excluding cards from my collection" then that's the total cost of the deck from scratch.
It's just because the article is half about presenting super-cheap Standard decks, and also picking one to go forward with, but most of the lists I'll be featuring you can pick up for under $5 from scratch, and none will break the bank!
Turbofog's always been a favourite of mine, and that Curse deck just looks like too much fun to pass up!
If you do start writing again soon I look forward to being able to read your articles!
I promise I'm gonna be writing about budget building again soon. But dang, you and Boosh are doing such a good job at it too. Maybe we'll have a trinity of budget on PureMTGO. :P
Loved the lists, definitely want to see some playtesting. I'm actually surprised at the White Aggro being under $5, but Hero of Bladehold is indeed a card that would crank this deck from about 6 all the way up to 11! :P Unfortunately, the price would go from 2 all the way up to 11!!!
Curse.dec is something I've always wanted to run, but never got around to brewing a full list. I might use your list as a springboard soon. :)
UG Turbofog is also awesome, I've always loved these Turbofog decks. Kinda makes me wish we didn't have to wait until February for Simic's return to Standard in Gatecrash. I think around then, I'll see how Turbofog fares with SOM Block and M12 cycled out.
Keep it up, bud!
Got to see the Riders theme deck in action when we teamed up in some impromptu 2hg tribal wars yesterday. The samurai guy with Basilisk Collar is sick, although less impressive against somebody who just has mutavaults for blockers most of the game.
If I'd remembered your post about your own kaleidoscope deck, I'd have suggested we duel those! We'll have to team 'em up in some 2hg some time.
The name of the deck has nothing to do with rocks or stones. The name comes from a deck that Sol Malka used to play that was named "The Rock and His Millions" and named after Dwayne Johnson, AKA The Rock. The signature card of the deck was Phyrexian Plaguelord. The deck was something of a nine days wonder and the name stuck for green/black decks.
Sol still plays once in a while. Back in the day, he was a real grinder and wrote a lot of good articles on the 'net.
I always enjoy your modern stuff Blippy, but the backgrounds in the deck lists make them hard to read. The two death cloud ones are not too bad, but the fae one is tough to read some of the cards.
thanks! I have to admit that I am too, there is a lot to talk about and it is mostly going to have a focus on competitive play... trying my best to have that ready to go for two weeks for now, but could be tight
@Unspeakable
That's exactly what I'm trying to do, rise above statistical variation by gathering a large data set. I also used to think that the variation was way higher than other formats, but I've found that I can usually get 2-1, even with a bad pool by squeezing every edge I can. We'll have to wait to see if this pans out, but so far my data supports the fact that someone can consistently beat 50% with solid play.
As for the EV of each pack opened, that data will be available in my forthcoming article. Having looked at the numbers, it would be impossible to go infinite at 50% win rate, I would say that it looks like 60-66% is what you will need to go infinite.
I'm looking forward to your Introduction to the Pauper format. I would like to venture into this format, but with such a large card pool and endless options...its hard to decide which deep end of the pool to jump into?
Thanks guys :D Your comments are appreciated! :)
Not really sure how I missed Trading Post's goodness. Looks like a card to pick up four of. It was great to hear all 3 of you back together again. Hope this is a more regular occurrence. I didn't end up playing the pre-release events despite the lowered cost but I did see BKibler crash and burn with his sealed decks in them.
Happy that Niv is coming back. Looks like draw matters again. :D
#1 - Glad to have yall back!
#2 - I've said since I really got into Magic that Wizards doesn't really care about eternal formats because they get so much more money off of new sets... old cards is all secondary market money
#3 - I think the tourney is a great idea esp trying to work rounds for those who can't put in hours in one day to do it... one of the holds for "new" people joining those who already join the classic PREs would be cost as everyone always says... you get this feel that its like FoW or you can't compete, tho maybe its just a lack of info on the format for those who are interested, but have never been down that path
Nice article. Happy Birthday
I always love the opening drawing. Happy (belated?) birthday man! And good job on the podcast!
Many happy returns. Good article, plentiful and varied content.
I played against a UB control deck kind of like this in my most recent daily (on the 29th), but it also used undying evil for the wicked combination with evoked mulldrifter. Spending 4 mana for 4 cards and a 3/3 flyer at the end of it is pretty gamebreaking!
A couple of list errors Affinity Shops should have 4 signal pests not 3 listed, and Aristocratic Acts of Artistry should have 6 spells listed, and 30 creatures listed.
A version of your UB Delver placed recently, I wasn't sure if you saw it.
https://www.wizards.com/Magic/Digital/MagicOnlineTourn.aspx?x=mtg/digita...
4 Dimir Aqueduct
7 Island
7 Swamp
2 Terramorphic Expanse
4 Chittering Rats
4 Delver of Secrets
3 Mulldrifter
3 Ninja of the Deep Hours
4 Phantasmal Bear
4 Ravenous Rats
3 Agony Warp
4 Brainstorm
3 Disfigure
2 Duress
3 Funeral Charm
1 Recoil
2 Snap
SB:
1 Deep Analysis
1 Disfigure
2 Duress
4 Echoing Decay
2 Mana Leak
1 Mulldrifter
1 Ninja of the Deep Hours
3 Snuff Out
This player favors Preordain over Brainstorm, and uses a 3/4th playset of Funeral Charms. Theres a couple differences in the creature lineup between your decklist and his, but on the whole, I think he (or she) is working towards the same idea.
The article is interesting, but I think the idea of evaluating the EV for 4-pack sealed using individual performance is inherently flawed. The format has a notoriously high level of luck, and opening cards like bonfire of the damned both shoots your profits high while also making it much easier to go 3-0 due to the ridiculously broken power of the card. A more sensible way to evalute the EV for a format is to calculate the EV for opening an average pack, multiply that by 4, assume a win percent of 50%, subtract the current cost of packs, and adding the value of packs you would win assuming average results. Of course, the EV for a format varies as the value of the cards and packs change, so this calculation is only good for a particular moment in time. Once you know the typical EV, you can adjust that better fit you personally if you believe your skill is better (or worse) than average. Any EV results based on individual performance are relatively meaningless, unless you are playing so many games that you are able to rise above statistical variation.
Since submitting this there has been a change:
http://www.wizards.com/Magic/Magazine/Article.aspx?x=mtg/daily/other/072...
New accounts will now include "New Player" tickets. These tickets will be used in 4-player, 2 match tournaments that will fire when there is enough people to play in the Limited Queues Room. The current product is M13 for these events though it will, I'm sure, change with each new core set. Each win will grant you 3 points and players with 6 points receive a copy of the promo card from that week's TNMO.
I'm going to do my best to keep adding updates for this article... at least until a time where the new client comes out...
I only read your first sentence and then I got angry. There's no functional difference between the two. We can't have a conversation if you're willing to insult me and then act like you didn't mean it that way. No one ever takes the exact meaning of your words as you meant them. They'll take them as they find them. If someone finds your word choice inappropriate, that's on you, not the person reading.
How's this for a reasonable demand? I want everyone to treat each other with respect. As long as that doesn't happen, I can't/won't play magic. Wizards doesn't respect me as a customer enough to make a client that doesn't break down every five minutes. Other players don't respect me to understand that this is a game, not a drug addiction where the only point is to get your high by beating someone with the strongest deck you have. There are far too many reasons for me to stay away and not enough for me to stay in.
I'm already working on getting a comparison of the EV of packs ready for this weeks article; check back in a couple days.
As for analyzing the differences that limited environments have on my win/loss rates, I think that is a fantastic idea, but I don't have enough data for the results to be anywhere close to statistically significant. Don't worry, though! I am keeping copious records of the formats I play in, so in a couple weeks, this should be a feature of the column.
Opening my account last week and seeing my collection gone was a bit unsettling, but after I went into the help room and saw it wasn't just me, I calmed down real quick. The thing I found amusing was how so many players kept complaining and complaining even after the ORC said "We're working on it." As awesome as MTGO is, it's still just a computer system run by humans. Mistakes happen.
I disagree with you saying the R/G/b is the defining deck in Block right now. The best deck is more of a 4 color green build with access to the best cards in the format. You really can't tell where Jund ends and Naya begins these days. but I do agree that the format has been solved.
Personally, I like the new format for TNMO. I don't have enough cards to play in all the formats (I'm really surprised that they offer Legacy and Modern), and don't have to spend the tix for a 6 pack M12 sealed just to get a promo card. But I would spend 5 tix to play in the same 6 pack phantom sealed event for the promo card. I think that changing TNMO to attract more new players is a good thing.