This article was great haha. But no mention that Moeller did the art for Saffi as well? I found it very funny after your small tangent on the quality of cards Wizards commissions him to draw.
I think it's worth noting that Vizkopa Guildmage can sometimes provide extra reach in a boardstate where they have infinite blockers on the ground and in the air. Charge in a 3/2 guy with 6 mana available, and you can guarantee they take 3 even if they block. If you get to 9 mana, you can guarantee a 6 point hit, which is often enough.
I find Basilica Guards to be quite playable in Orzhov, as you can never have too many cards that say "Extort" on them. Tons of extort and tons of 1-3 cast spells gives you enough lifedrain to win almost any race. If he blocks a 2/2 or a 3/3 a couple times, you're even more guaranteed to win the race and just extort them out if you can't finish them with actual attackers.
You guys have far more confidence in me than I do. I think I would have an edge in say a 10 match series, but I'm pretty worried about a single best 2 out of 3.
I do think this is a case of where knowing the specifics of his deck is a HUGE advantage for me. I think if I didn't know I was up against storm game 1 and didn't know the specifics, it would be fairly close to 50/50 or at least a better matchup for him. Since I have that information, I can more aggressively mulligan or keep a hand that I wouldn't otherwise keep since its good against his deck.
Scavenging Ooze is situationally great against dredge, as they generally don't have an answer for it. It's too slow most of the time, but it does give you a chance game 1 against dredge, especially on the play. Turn 1 Mana dork, turn 2 Ooze + wasteland, and then you pretty much just win after that. It involves a great draw, but it does give you a better shot against dredge game 1 than most decks. Even if you don't have a wasteland and can remove a creature from their GY you are in decent shape.
Also, LordSapphire and myself will be playing sometime this weekend, once we have an official time I will let you guys know.
Moments Peace is sorely lacking in this build - with the wall and/or archaeomancer, this is the reason I push almost all opposing sideboards to run Faerie Macabre - uncounterable, free...and REALLY wrecks plans in a hurry.
Fade Away looks good on paper, but in gameplay it feels like a "C-"
How about Moment's Peace (creatures) or Early Frost (counters) in the board? MP could go in a 2/1 split with Fade Away. Two copies of Early Frost presumably could replace one copy each of Negate and Dispel for value. Against the blue decks, Early Frost is better for going off, no?
Isn't selling your collection kind of a big deal, or is this something AJ does regularly? I wouldn't have thought that doing so would make economic sense if he's planning on re-buying (given that most of his collection is probably out of print so prices on most of it are likely to go up over time - especially if he had a legacy mana base, which I'm guessing he did), so is this his way of scaling back his involvement with the game? I know the podcast isn't meant to just be all about the hosts, but would have appreciated a little more discussion about that sellof than a throwaway comment :).
Oh, don't worry. WotC itself took it out of context and renamed it "Exiler" for the precon deck. Granted, it was probably required in order to avoid legal actions or compensations with the creator, but nobody would ever call the archetype - or anything else! - "Exiler". :)
I understand. I know that I didn't invent the idea of calling the deck D&T. I was just apologising if the deck name had been taken out of context and/or it was confusing to anyone. I wasn't aware of its origins in Legacy or the fundamentals of that particular deck.
Like I said above, it was never about "taxing". However, the deck runs Thalia now, because well, that's a no-brainer. It was always based on fast, efficient beaters, the original key creatures were Serra Avenger (that's still firmly there) and Jotun Grunt.
And how is it a "failed attempt"? The original, if updated, WW form (the WG version, which probably then morphed into Maverick, Hatebear and co., was called "Green and Taxes") is still played as of right now, with great results. You could see it ending Top 4 in several SCG Opens last year, and as recently as October 2012 in Cincinnati. Top 4 in a Legacy with hundreds of participants is nothing to sneeze at, it probably did better than any Fish deck present.
The Cincinnati list, by Thomas Enevoldsen, was this one:
MAIN DECK:
4 Serra Avenger
4 Flickerwisp
3 Mangara of Corondor
4 Mother of Runes
4 Stoneforge Mystic
4 Thalia, Guardian of Thraben
4 Phyrexian Revoker
4 Swords to Plowshares
4 AEther Vial
1 Umezawa's Jitte
1 Sword of Fire and Ice
1 Batterskull
Wait, I believe there's been some confusion/misunderstanding here. You're not the first to call this Modern deck "Death & Taxes" like the Legacy one. In fact, I never thought you were. You can find threads on MTG Salvation discussing the deck. Some of the lists are more similar to the original, but some are just like yours. I see now that another common ground is that the Modern version tries to work some mana denial via Tectonic Edge and Ghost Quarter, in place of Wasteland and Rishadan Port (which is kinda embarrassing, but that's what we have in Modern).
When I was wondering why these names are inherited by decks that are almost entirely different from their "ancestor", I was talking in general, not about you.
I can't find the interview with the original creator of the deck (probably because I can't remember his name!), but I recall they asked about the name, and he just loved the expression "Nothing is certain but death and taxes". No particular reference to the concept of "taxing" in MTG. In fact, the archetype didn't run any "tax" effect until very recently, when Thalia joined its lineup.
I believe the legacy deck ran generally ran Vials and Wastelands and Rishadan Ports, so it's not completely out of the question that it may at some point have ran Glowriders or other "tax" effects then in existence. The generally accepted common elements of D&T were the presence of equipment beyond just a single miser's copy of Jitte (swords were not common pre-SFM), the Mangara/Flickerwisp tricks, and access to whatever disruption white/black had available.
In legacy, Death and Taxes has always just been another in the long line of failed attempts to make non-blue decks that could beat both "fair" decks and combo decks. It always had a pretty decent match against fair decks, but never really was any good against combo, no matter what its proponents said. In that respect, GW Maverick was its spiritual successor, basically displacing D&T variants during Maverick's run of success (which is now over.)
The hatebear angle, as well as the mana denial plan, really could be argued to be one of the defining attributes of the deck's *current* iteration, with the cute Mangara/Flickerwisp tricks falling out of favor anyhow. So I don't really think your use of the name is all that far off from the deck's original spirit. However, in crossing over to the Modern format, this kind of deck is most well known for having been played and tested by Brian Kibler on several occasions, and was always referred to by him as Hatebears, so I guess I go with Kibler in the end.
I am casting my Rainbow of Ponies for 18x damage. I really want it to hit everything.
I don't know if you noticed the Immortal Servitude deck in my article where I cast it for 3 to win with 4x Biovisionary. Obviously this doesn't quite count as "breaking" it since it took 12 turns or so but it shows that it can be done.
charles is kind of a d@#$, no?
Charles is right: Spell Burst is good! It definitely took me by surprise! Stay tuned for my match videos.
...............did not notice that
This article was great haha. But no mention that Moeller did the art for Saffi as well? I found it very funny after your small tangent on the quality of cards Wizards commissions him to draw.
I'll take Crystalline Sliver any day of the week. ^^
Great article, but I'm shocked that Scavenging Ooze is nowhere to be seen. It really is the best bear.
I think it's worth noting that Vizkopa Guildmage can sometimes provide extra reach in a boardstate where they have infinite blockers on the ground and in the air. Charge in a 3/2 guy with 6 mana available, and you can guarantee they take 3 even if they block. If you get to 9 mana, you can guarantee a 6 point hit, which is often enough.
I find Basilica Guards to be quite playable in Orzhov, as you can never have too many cards that say "Extort" on them. Tons of extort and tons of 1-3 cast spells gives you enough lifedrain to win almost any race. If he blocks a 2/2 or a 3/3 a couple times, you're even more guaranteed to win the race and just extort them out if you can't finish them with actual attackers.
Standing ovation! (On bear's hind legs.)
You guys have far more confidence in me than I do. I think I would have an edge in say a 10 match series, but I'm pretty worried about a single best 2 out of 3.
I do think this is a case of where knowing the specifics of his deck is a HUGE advantage for me. I think if I didn't know I was up against storm game 1 and didn't know the specifics, it would be fairly close to 50/50 or at least a better matchup for him. Since I have that information, I can more aggressively mulligan or keep a hand that I wouldn't otherwise keep since its good against his deck.
Scavenging Ooze is situationally great against dredge, as they generally don't have an answer for it. It's too slow most of the time, but it does give you a chance game 1 against dredge, especially on the play. Turn 1 Mana dork, turn 2 Ooze + wasteland, and then you pretty much just win after that. It involves a great draw, but it does give you a better shot against dredge game 1 than most decks. Even if you don't have a wasteland and can remove a creature from their GY you are in decent shape.
Also, LordSapphire and myself will be playing sometime this weekend, once we have an official time I will let you guys know.
Hah I never did say I could count properly. I thought it was more.
2nd time I've done it. I needed to liquidate an asset for reasons I won't go into. Rebuild is progressing well.
Moments Peace is sorely lacking in this build - with the wall and/or archaeomancer, this is the reason I push almost all opposing sideboards to run Faerie Macabre - uncounterable, free...and REALLY wrecks plans in a hurry.
Fade Away looks good on paper, but in gameplay it feels like a "C-"
I'm amused that I finished reading the article at the exact same time the song finished in the background :)
How about Moment's Peace (creatures) or Early Frost (counters) in the board? MP could go in a 2/1 split with Fade Away. Two copies of Early Frost presumably could replace one copy each of Negate and Dispel for value. Against the blue decks, Early Frost is better for going off, no?
This is his 3rd or 4th time doing it since I've known him. So its a pretty regular thing.
Isn't selling your collection kind of a big deal, or is this something AJ does regularly? I wouldn't have thought that doing so would make economic sense if he's planning on re-buying (given that most of his collection is probably out of print so prices on most of it are likely to go up over time - especially if he had a legacy mana base, which I'm guessing he did), so is this his way of scaling back his involvement with the game? I know the podcast isn't meant to just be all about the hosts, but would have appreciated a little more discussion about that sellof than a throwaway comment :).
Oh, don't worry. WotC itself took it out of context and renamed it "Exiler" for the precon deck. Granted, it was probably required in order to avoid legal actions or compensations with the creator, but nobody would ever call the archetype - or anything else! - "Exiler". :)
I understand. I know that I didn't invent the idea of calling the deck D&T. I was just apologising if the deck name had been taken out of context and/or it was confusing to anyone. I wasn't aware of its origins in Legacy or the fundamentals of that particular deck.
Isn't that what I confirmed? :) Adding the anecdotal edge, if sourceless.
Isn't that what I said?
Like I said above, it was never about "taxing". However, the deck runs Thalia now, because well, that's a no-brainer. It was always based on fast, efficient beaters, the original key creatures were Serra Avenger (that's still firmly there) and Jotun Grunt.
And how is it a "failed attempt"? The original, if updated, WW form (the WG version, which probably then morphed into Maverick, Hatebear and co., was called "Green and Taxes") is still played as of right now, with great results. You could see it ending Top 4 in several SCG Opens last year, and as recently as October 2012 in Cincinnati. Top 4 in a Legacy with hundreds of participants is nothing to sneeze at, it probably did better than any Fish deck present.
The Cincinnati list, by Thomas Enevoldsen, was this one:
MAIN DECK:
4 Serra Avenger
4 Flickerwisp
3 Mangara of Corondor
4 Mother of Runes
4 Stoneforge Mystic
4 Thalia, Guardian of Thraben
4 Phyrexian Revoker
4 Swords to Plowshares
4 AEther Vial
1 Umezawa's Jitte
1 Sword of Fire and Ice
1 Batterskull
9 Plains
4 Karakas
4 Wasteland
4 Rishadan Port
1 Horizon Canopy
SIDEBOARD:
3 Ethersworn Canonist
3 Relic of Progenitus
2 Cataclysm
2 Gut Shot
1 Pithing Needle
1 Manriki-Gusari
1 Leonin Bola
1 Oblivion Ring
1 Fiend Hunter
Wait, I believe there's been some confusion/misunderstanding here. You're not the first to call this Modern deck "Death & Taxes" like the Legacy one. In fact, I never thought you were. You can find threads on MTG Salvation discussing the deck. Some of the lists are more similar to the original, but some are just like yours. I see now that another common ground is that the Modern version tries to work some mana denial via Tectonic Edge and Ghost Quarter, in place of Wasteland and Rishadan Port (which is kinda embarrassing, but that's what we have in Modern).
When I was wondering why these names are inherited by decks that are almost entirely different from their "ancestor", I was talking in general, not about you.
I can't find the interview with the original creator of the deck (probably because I can't remember his name!), but I recall they asked about the name, and he just loved the expression "Nothing is certain but death and taxes". No particular reference to the concept of "taxing" in MTG. In fact, the archetype didn't run any "tax" effect until very recently, when Thalia joined its lineup.
I believe the legacy deck ran generally ran Vials and Wastelands and Rishadan Ports, so it's not completely out of the question that it may at some point have ran Glowriders or other "tax" effects then in existence. The generally accepted common elements of D&T were the presence of equipment beyond just a single miser's copy of Jitte (swords were not common pre-SFM), the Mangara/Flickerwisp tricks, and access to whatever disruption white/black had available.
In legacy, Death and Taxes has always just been another in the long line of failed attempts to make non-blue decks that could beat both "fair" decks and combo decks. It always had a pretty decent match against fair decks, but never really was any good against combo, no matter what its proponents said. In that respect, GW Maverick was its spiritual successor, basically displacing D&T variants during Maverick's run of success (which is now over.)
The hatebear angle, as well as the mana denial plan, really could be argued to be one of the defining attributes of the deck's *current* iteration, with the cute Mangara/Flickerwisp tricks falling out of favor anyhow. So I don't really think your use of the name is all that far off from the deck's original spirit. However, in crossing over to the Modern format, this kind of deck is most well known for having been played and tested by Brian Kibler on several occasions, and was always referred to by him as Hatebears, so I guess I go with Kibler in the end.
I am casting my Rainbow of Ponies for 18x damage. I really want it to hit everything.
I don't know if you noticed the Immortal Servitude deck in my article where I cast it for 3 to win with 4x Biovisionary. Obviously this doesn't quite count as "breaking" it since it took 12 turns or so but it shows that it can be done.