1. DGR is a relatively fast format. Avoid expensive cards, or cards that don’t affect the battlefield in the early game.
--it is very easy to draft a deck with cluestones that plays 16 lands, and hits six drops on turn four or five.
--even your own data shows majority of games finishing turns 8+, meaning your six drops can matter on turn 5 for several turns
2. The Dragon’s Maze pack is going to be light on playables. Be careful not to overcommit to underpowered cards.
--Dragon's Maze has tons of playables if you how to build right
3. The majority of the field is made up of decks that can play large creatures early in the game. You need to be able to interact with them.
--the majority of the field usually plays something on turn 2 or 3 to start with, turn 1 guildgate is the most common t1 play, this isn't super-fast like innistrad or zendikar
4. The fixing in DGR is just bad. It is important to take cards that are easy to cast, and also to keep in mind that the format will have a little bit higher level of natural variance.
--the fixing in DGR is amazing! it is often possible to pick up 2-4 guildgates in the first 2-4 picks if you open a crap rare and are undecided on colors, and very easy to draft cluestones to splash later with... the natural variance of the format is lower than M14 or other blocks with less mana fixing MEANING you are less likely to miss a color at a crucial moment due to the abundance of mana artifacts and guildgates
5. The secret to DGR is that there is no secret. This is not a format about archetypes.
--DGR has several archetypes including gatekeepers, three color splashes, and each of the guilds... it is very important to recognize which guild rares mean you should switch into those guilds in later packs
6. The most effective strategy in DGR is to take cards that are cheap, powerful, easy on the colored mana requirements, and flexible, and not worry about how they fit in a particular deck type.
--the most effective strategy in DGR is to pay attention to what people are passing, just like any other draft format, and select guild(s) from there. For example, a late pick DGM guildgate (say simic) is a clear signal that simic will be amazing in GTC and you should consider going straight u/g.
FYI, I've gotten to the finals in 5/10 (won 3) of the last ten 8-4 DGR's I've played in. I don't have a set strategy other than build on a curve, based on what I've been passed/open.
Also, runner's bane sucks. It's only good against dimir and orzhov. Other archtypes play scavenge or pump effects. I've knocked many off with giant growths or other nonsense. I'd rather play inaction injunction and draw the card instead.
Yeah, I didn't explain this is much detail, since I talked about concept #1 a lot in GTC.
Basically, when the format as a whole is fast, it is often better to go with a slower deck in order to combat the metagame. That is what made Dimir so strong in GTC. But the speed of the format is important, because it means that you have to focus more of your resources on things that interact with the board early on. I tend to draft more controlling deck in DGR.
On the second comment, I can't really say for sure. I should say that I wasn't advocating that you should center your deck on a GTC guild. I was just pointing out that GTC is where you find the strongest cards in the set, so it is your most important pack. I'm not 100% sure whether that means you want to force a GTC guild to try and get more out of that pack, or whether you want to just take the good stuff out of that pack and lean harder on an RTR guild. Your thoughts could be right, but it's a very complicated thing that I can't be sure on.
Right now, I'm leaning towards centering your deck on an RTR guild, because in a three color combination, it means you get a little bit higher selection from GTC, which means you can pick up more of the powerful cards for cheap. But I might be wrong.
I have found that while the format is pretty fast, it is relatively easy to play a slow deck in any color combination, especially blue. I like playing decks with a few 6-7cc finishers, and dgr easily allows that. You just have to make sure you have the early game stall cards like the 0/5 wall and bounce/removal spells.
In my experience you are also much better off going into one of the rtr guilds since they are almost always completely open. Yeah I know the pros say otherwise, but I would rather be in a completely open guild rather than sharing boros with 2 other people.
Thanks! Our team really is a sick group this year. I think that WotC made the mistake of ratcheting up the difficulty really high after last year's difficulty. But you never know... they might pull the doom switch on us :)
Desolation Angel: damn you, HTML editor! I don't know how that did happen. I'll fix it at the next update (which will be in 6 months, btw). Demonpedia is also currently offline, it's going back online soon.
Baneslayer: I remain of my opinion and I actually intended to take her down a notch on purpose. She dies to Doom Blade like most of the others, wins you games only if the opponent is unprepared. Take Sigarda for comparison: she can win you games even when the opponent IS decently prepared. I once saw her nullify Emrakul (with the help of a Yavimaya Hollow) long enough to wrath him away. Try to do that with a Baneslayer. :)
Your request: I may do that, but not here, as this is not a tool for Tribal Wars, it's a tool for all Constructed formats (Commander is prominently featured, for instance. Plus, Tribal Wars and tribal are two very different things, as the former is a format, the latter is an approach to deck-building, or even set design. So when I say "tribal" here, I'm not necessarily talking of Tribal Wars.)
A Tribal Wars article series about specific tribes and their most successful builds, now, that's actually a good idea.
Great work. This took a lot of effort and looks so polished and well, encyclopedic. I had a fun time reading all the way through.
A few points. The Desolation Angel text got messed up somehow; it's likely an easy fix. I would also mention the $100+ price tag of a foil Reya (in the auction room, no less) back in the day before Invasion got reprinted to death (even crap Invasion foil rares often sold for 6 tickets). Baneslayer had nothing on her in that regard.
Speaking of Baneslayer - this is the only one I disagree with you majorly. An 8? Compared to some of the stuff you give 10s, that is ridiculous. 5 mana is probably 2 turns faster than 6 mana which is probably 2 turns faster than 7 mana, unless acceleration is somehow present, reducing options. This girl can realistically win the game by herself as a 5-drop, and more importantly keeps you from losing it. Compare to Battlegrace Angel. [Edit: removed failed example situation.] Battlegrace may be able to gain some amount of life the turn she hits (provided there is another creature who won't die), but Baneslayer will prevent even much more life (unless direct damage) on that same turn from the opponent by herself.
Edit: I also have a feature request for the article. Based on either your experience or actual stats or both, could you provide a top 10 list of non-Angel "best friend" cards for tribal? Like Wrath of God, for example. Also, desirable would be a couple of winning Angel decklists for tribal. These would be a nice touch to get people started, and could apply to other tribes as well. Thanks!
Jace is harder to get rid of- especially when your cascade targets are Hymn to Tourach, Ancestral Vision and Brainstorm.
There are tons of ways to get rid of artifacts, but not that much targeted removal that can deal with planeswalkers. What removal is actually there can't be played by every legacy deck, either.
Of course, there are other decks. There are other ways to win in Legacy. I just still haven't forgiven Wizards for letting Caw Blade happen in standard. I suppose I feel the need to complain whenever I see Jace breaking the game once again.
(But if you think I'm wrong, just ignore what I've said :P)
Shardless Agent and big Jace....once again proving that Jace, TMS was a card that never should have been printed. Cast Shardless Agent, cascade. Cast Jace, go -1 to put Shardless Agent back in your hand. Cascade again next turn. Ugh.
I've been playing Pauper in paper for a while now....I checked the card values of stuff I've already put together, and 12 cards from the online deck cost more than the whole 75 paper cards put together. I guess, needless to say, I will continue playing Pauper in paper. :)
Also, for those who can afford it, Spinning Darkness is really, really good.
The comparison with a job is incorrect, as most people have jobs in order to earn money, while the vast majority of MTG players do it in order to have fun. Like many other hobbies, MTG requires an investment of time and money (and it's far from the top of the ranking for "most expensive hobbies" at that). Therefore, the mistake I see in the story is in fact trying not to spend money, or more exactly, to regard playing magic as a for-profit activity (the profit being measured in free drafts) instead of a for-fun activity, as this leads to the "must-win" pressure which can then turn into the ruinous "must-recoup-losses" attitude. Consider a person spending money on an online game or on some obscure trading card game without tournament activity. There isn't even a theoretical possibility of "recouping" the money spent, much less a chance of earning anything, so it is a straight trade: money for the fun of playing the game. The fact that in MTG there is a possibility to get substantial prizes shouldn't change this. When I sit down at a FNM draft, I write off the starting fee as "expenses - hobby". Surely I'm glad if I open a money rare or win some free packs, but this is not the reason I play in the first place and so is a nice bonus, not a part of some value calculation.
Do the magic invitationals count for FTV20 potential pools? Those used to feature Vintage heavily back in the day 96-97 at least. There may be hope for Force of Will if they are culling from these tournaments.
I agree about MBC by and far it can be a fun cheep deck.
As for worry about cheating we do have a fail safe for that in that decks must be entered into gatherling before the event they are not published until after the event but the host is able to check the decks for errors.
I am looking forward to Standard Pauper PEZ should be a nice little switch to things
I'd say there was at least medium power creep just between the Alpha Elvish Archers and the Beta Elvish Archers, let alone what they've printed *since* 1993.
1. DGR is a relatively fast format. Avoid expensive cards, or cards that don’t affect the battlefield in the early game.
--it is very easy to draft a deck with cluestones that plays 16 lands, and hits six drops on turn four or five.
--even your own data shows majority of games finishing turns 8+, meaning your six drops can matter on turn 5 for several turns
2. The Dragon’s Maze pack is going to be light on playables. Be careful not to overcommit to underpowered cards.
--Dragon's Maze has tons of playables if you how to build right
3. The majority of the field is made up of decks that can play large creatures early in the game. You need to be able to interact with them.
--the majority of the field usually plays something on turn 2 or 3 to start with, turn 1 guildgate is the most common t1 play, this isn't super-fast like innistrad or zendikar
4. The fixing in DGR is just bad. It is important to take cards that are easy to cast, and also to keep in mind that the format will have a little bit higher level of natural variance.
--the fixing in DGR is amazing! it is often possible to pick up 2-4 guildgates in the first 2-4 picks if you open a crap rare and are undecided on colors, and very easy to draft cluestones to splash later with... the natural variance of the format is lower than M14 or other blocks with less mana fixing MEANING you are less likely to miss a color at a crucial moment due to the abundance of mana artifacts and guildgates
5. The secret to DGR is that there is no secret. This is not a format about archetypes.
--DGR has several archetypes including gatekeepers, three color splashes, and each of the guilds... it is very important to recognize which guild rares mean you should switch into those guilds in later packs
6. The most effective strategy in DGR is to take cards that are cheap, powerful, easy on the colored mana requirements, and flexible, and not worry about how they fit in a particular deck type.
--the most effective strategy in DGR is to pay attention to what people are passing, just like any other draft format, and select guild(s) from there. For example, a late pick DGM guildgate (say simic) is a clear signal that simic will be amazing in GTC and you should consider going straight u/g.
FYI, I've gotten to the finals in 5/10 (won 3) of the last ten 8-4 DGR's I've played in. I don't have a set strategy other than build on a curve, based on what I've been passed/open.
Also, runner's bane sucks. It's only good against dimir and orzhov. Other archtypes play scavenge or pump effects. I've knocked many off with giant growths or other nonsense. I'd rather play inaction injunction and draw the card instead.
Yeah, I didn't explain this is much detail, since I talked about concept #1 a lot in GTC.
Basically, when the format as a whole is fast, it is often better to go with a slower deck in order to combat the metagame. That is what made Dimir so strong in GTC. But the speed of the format is important, because it means that you have to focus more of your resources on things that interact with the board early on. I tend to draft more controlling deck in DGR.
On the second comment, I can't really say for sure. I should say that I wasn't advocating that you should center your deck on a GTC guild. I was just pointing out that GTC is where you find the strongest cards in the set, so it is your most important pack. I'm not 100% sure whether that means you want to force a GTC guild to try and get more out of that pack, or whether you want to just take the good stuff out of that pack and lean harder on an RTR guild. Your thoughts could be right, but it's a very complicated thing that I can't be sure on.
Right now, I'm leaning towards centering your deck on an RTR guild, because in a three color combination, it means you get a little bit higher selection from GTC, which means you can pick up more of the powerful cards for cheap. But I might be wrong.
I have found that while the format is pretty fast, it is relatively easy to play a slow deck in any color combination, especially blue. I like playing decks with a few 6-7cc finishers, and dgr easily allows that. You just have to make sure you have the early game stall cards like the 0/5 wall and bounce/removal spells.
In my experience you are also much better off going into one of the rtr guilds since they are almost always completely open. Yeah I know the pros say otherwise, but I would rather be in a completely open guild rather than sharing boros with 2 other people.
Thanks! Our team really is a sick group this year. I think that WotC made the mistake of ratcheting up the difficulty really high after last year's difficulty. But you never know... they might pull the doom switch on us :)
Desolation Angel: damn you, HTML editor! I don't know how that did happen. I'll fix it at the next update (which will be in 6 months, btw). Demonpedia is also currently offline, it's going back online soon.
Baneslayer: I remain of my opinion and I actually intended to take her down a notch on purpose. She dies to Doom Blade like most of the others, wins you games only if the opponent is unprepared. Take Sigarda for comparison: she can win you games even when the opponent IS decently prepared. I once saw her nullify Emrakul (with the help of a Yavimaya Hollow) long enough to wrath him away. Try to do that with a Baneslayer. :)
Your request: I may do that, but not here, as this is not a tool for Tribal Wars, it's a tool for all Constructed formats (Commander is prominently featured, for instance. Plus, Tribal Wars and tribal are two very different things, as the former is a format, the latter is an approach to deck-building, or even set design. So when I say "tribal" here, I'm not necessarily talking of Tribal Wars.)
A Tribal Wars article series about specific tribes and their most successful builds, now, that's actually a good idea.
Congratulations on the Community Cup invite. The team looks really good this year. Good luck and hope you beat WOTC.
Interesting article as always!
Great work. This took a lot of effort and looks so polished and well, encyclopedic. I had a fun time reading all the way through.
A few points. The Desolation Angel text got messed up somehow; it's likely an easy fix. I would also mention the $100+ price tag of a foil Reya (in the auction room, no less) back in the day before Invasion got reprinted to death (even crap Invasion foil rares often sold for 6 tickets). Baneslayer had nothing on her in that regard.
Speaking of Baneslayer - this is the only one I disagree with you majorly. An 8? Compared to some of the stuff you give 10s, that is ridiculous. 5 mana is probably 2 turns faster than 6 mana which is probably 2 turns faster than 7 mana, unless acceleration is somehow present, reducing options. This girl can realistically win the game by herself as a 5-drop, and more importantly keeps you from losing it. Compare to Battlegrace Angel. [Edit: removed failed example situation.] Battlegrace may be able to gain some amount of life the turn she hits (provided there is another creature who won't die), but Baneslayer will prevent even much more life (unless direct damage) on that same turn from the opponent by herself.
Edit: I also have a feature request for the article. Based on either your experience or actual stats or both, could you provide a top 10 list of non-Angel "best friend" cards for tribal? Like Wrath of God, for example. Also, desirable would be a couple of winning Angel decklists for tribal. These would be a nice touch to get people started, and could apply to other tribes as well. Thanks!
best comment
Tnx. I will try to make more articles that will help STDSB players.
Thanks for the information, great article.
Fun article! And boy does it bring back memories of all the Mexican standoffs between Tim, Nettling Imp, and Royal Assassin during college.
Jace is harder to get rid of- especially when your cascade targets are Hymn to Tourach, Ancestral Vision and Brainstorm.
There are tons of ways to get rid of artifacts, but not that much targeted removal that can deal with planeswalkers. What removal is actually there can't be played by every legacy deck, either.
Of course, there are other decks. There are other ways to win in Legacy. I just still haven't forgiven Wizards for letting Caw Blade happen in standard. I suppose I feel the need to complain whenever I see Jace breaking the game once again.
(But if you think I'm wrong, just ignore what I've said :P)
How is that different than Shardless Agent + Crystal Shard? or Eratic Portal?
Shardless Agent and big Jace....once again proving that Jace, TMS was a card that never should have been printed. Cast Shardless Agent, cascade. Cast Jace, go -1 to put Shardless Agent back in your hand. Cascade again next turn. Ugh.
I've been playing Pauper in paper for a while now....I checked the card values of stuff I've already put together, and 12 cards from the online deck cost more than the whole 75 paper cards put together. I guess, needless to say, I will continue playing Pauper in paper. :)
Also, for those who can afford it, Spinning Darkness is really, really good.
These videos are really good. I like the idea on this. Keep it up. - YOR Health
Good job on this by the way. I learned a lot from this. - YOR Health
The comparison with a job is incorrect, as most people have jobs in order to earn money, while the vast majority of MTG players do it in order to have fun. Like many other hobbies, MTG requires an investment of time and money (and it's far from the top of the ranking for "most expensive hobbies" at that). Therefore, the mistake I see in the story is in fact trying not to spend money, or more exactly, to regard playing magic as a for-profit activity (the profit being measured in free drafts) instead of a for-fun activity, as this leads to the "must-win" pressure which can then turn into the ruinous "must-recoup-losses" attitude. Consider a person spending money on an online game or on some obscure trading card game without tournament activity. There isn't even a theoretical possibility of "recouping" the money spent, much less a chance of earning anything, so it is a straight trade: money for the fun of playing the game. The fact that in MTG there is a possibility to get substantial prizes shouldn't change this. When I sit down at a FNM draft, I write off the starting fee as "expenses - hobby". Surely I'm glad if I open a money rare or win some free packs, but this is not the reason I play in the first place and so is a nice bonus, not a part of some value calculation.
This is a good progress already. I love it. Keep up the good work. - YORHealth
This is nice. I like the idea on this. Keep it up. - YORHealth
Good to see these videos. I learned a lot from this. - Scott Safadi
It's obvious that Peter's excitement about his foreknowledge is only being contained through great force of will.
Do the magic invitationals count for FTV20 potential pools? Those used to feature Vintage heavily back in the day 96-97 at least. There may be hope for Force of Will if they are culling from these tournaments.
Thanks :)
I agree about MBC by and far it can be a fun cheep deck.
As for worry about cheating we do have a fail safe for that in that decks must be entered into gatherling before the event they are not published until after the event but the host is able to check the decks for errors.
I am looking forward to Standard Pauper PEZ should be a nice little switch to things
I'd say there was at least medium power creep just between the Alpha Elvish Archers and the Beta Elvish Archers, let alone what they've printed *since* 1993.