I think I have to side with Peter here. The issue he raises is simple. Lying about the price of cards is ripping people off. No, you are not entitled to rip someone off because you looked up the values of the cards.
If both parties agree to the same pricing system, like a particular website, then both parties know what their card's "value" is according to that site.
I think it's fair for a trader to make a proffit based upon arbitration, like being able to pick up a card for .75 on one site then trading it at 1.50 according to another system while the cards he gets are valued lower on that site. Speculation is also fine. Or if the trading partner is ok with losing value in order to get the cards he needs. But lying about the prices of cards is wrong. A few weeks ago I saw someone tell their trading partner that the value of their Molten-tail Masticore was $8.00. No system ever valued it that low, and I nearly reported the person to the store owner. That's pretty close to stealing. He didn't say "I value it at $8", he said "it's going for $8", and I happen to know that this person knows better. That is the type of trading for proffit that is frowned upon here.
I must resist the urge...I just realized how good trinket mage into Everflowing chalice would be...or into voltaic key, and i really want to build a Liquimetal Coating deck...must resist the dark side of magic, i cannot go to the islands...
Time / Money - You mention this that you could spend less time working for more money/tix - which is true on one facet. The other facet is that not all people can pick up extra work/income as wanted, and likewise jobs are a responsibility - and hence often are required minimum hours/days. Essentially meaning you could be committing to a lot more to earn - or in some case have a inability to. Not only that when you work could result in no MTGO when your peers play. Just food for thought.
Behaviour / Accessibility - I find it interesting that this is not raised as heavily as for me it is moreso a price driver in that if a bot is open and available (and not lag to s#$t) then it has a infinitely higher chance than one which is constantly interrupted of making people $$. One example I explained to a friend was the fact a BOT does not decriminate as to who, how many, how long trades are with people. Essentially you could continually lock up certain bots from being available to trade - in order to force the market where to go.
Certianly some good explorations of block possibilities here.
I think you're right about green black having major mana problems with only one set out, and aggro doesn't need more hands that just lose due to mana (too much, not enough, + wrong colors) having to mull even more is just too much no matter how ridiculous Putrefax is, (have you considered mono-green infect? Maybe there aren't enough good cards for it)
I kind of prefer the old mindslaver art, glad I had a couple of the older ones to sell off for tix for a little xtra cash.
Precursor Golem just seems too fragile to me, out of the sideboard vs some decks he could probably be great though.
thx man I really appreciate it, fyi to anyone who may have me on their buddy list I have a new account PoorMansMagic that I put together if wizards customer service ever fixes it lol when I'm drafting and stuff you'll find me on that name as opposed to JustSin
Dang, so sad to see you go dude. I probably have several extra pauper cards in order for you to make a competitive deck, hit me up online if you are interested. For awhile I was playing competitive pauper, but it really isn't my cup of tea to be honest so as long as I don't need the cards for legacy, you are welcome to have some.
In a nutshell, here is the biggest problem people face while trying to turn small profits online.
Quote: "You might even get lucky offering it at $46 if you wait long enough. However, if you want to get into another draft, and selling that Megahype Walletslayer is what will get you the TIX and packs to get in, waiting for hours is probably not an option."
Most people lack patience. I recently wrote in my last article that newer players lack patience in their game play, but this is also very true for trading in both paper and MTGO. I know it is hard to believe, but I remember buying Jace, TMS at around 32 tickets and selling them for 36. I did this several times in the same day with little to no effort. The only people who can honestly turn profits to make it worth their time are the bigger dealers. They have the resources to stay ontop of all the price changes and even speculation. For those of us doing small trading, just trying to turn small profits can be done with just a little bit of good old fashioned patience!
I'm fairly new to MTGO, so I'm curious as to how popular block constructed really is online. In paper, there are GP's and such that dictate a healthy interest in block constructed, are there any such events like that on MODO, or is the highest level of support daily events or 2/8-man queues?
Hey guys another great episode, I'm really looking forward to what MED4 brings us, interesting that if you hold down shift while typing "4" you get "$", and if any power is in MED4 one imagines it will make tons and tons of "$" for wizards. Did they every say they wouldn't introduce mythics into MED4?, oh man Mythic power cards, ok this chain of thought is just getting worse and worse I have to stop.
It was great having AJ at our event this weekend, interestingly one of the other 18 contestants copied his deck for the most part and played him in round one after having play tested against him, AJ got the better of the mirror in any case. Strange to see 2 of the same deck in one event when the deck hasn't appeared at all before.
Just wanted to clear up the price points, which of course you don't actually have to know since the Heirloom Legal Card List is static once made and you should just refer to that. The cutoffs are based on 2.5x the minimum cost for each rarity on Mtgotraders. At that we winded up with $0.05 cents for a common $0.10 for an uncommon $0.20 for a rare and $1.00 for a Mythic. Most decks cost less than $4.00 altogether.
I think the comparison to the stock market radically exaggerates the difficulty of predicting price fluctuations in Magic, which has very predictable cycles. While I agree with you that speculating on a specific card to get hot based on a tournament performance is in fact quite challenging unless you are very well connected at the high levels of professional magic, speculating in a broader sense is quite easy. Back when I played IRL I put maybe $300-500 into my magic collection including the cost of tournament entries. Three or so years later I sold my collection on Ebay for over $3000, and that was a "sell to a dealer" price. And I certainly was no Medina on the trade floor. I typically only traded with friends at college and then at tournaments I'd attend (typically 3-5 per year -- the three prereleases and maybe a couple of Grand Prix Trials or PTQs), and I didn't try to rip people off or speculate on particular cards. I usually was trading for things I wanted or things that I thought I might want in the future. I never entertained the idea of "binder momentum" or whatever.
What I did do was trade for standard cards during extended season and extended cards during standard season (especially right around rotation time when cards rotating out of standard dramatically drop in price and people are eager to unload them). When cards I had did get hot I'd trade them off for staple cards that were more likely to maintain their value over time.
I agree that the market is a bit more complex now as there are more people speculating now than before, and the changes to tournament formats have altered the cycles a bit from what they used to be -- but I'd argue that it's still a relatively predictable pattern.
Great I appreciate the break down, I had considered it a worthless card, but now I'm a bit more inclined to take it even as great sideboard material, and yea thanks I never even though about Soliton, that's a great way to use it!
I read this article on my phone during the long drive to Memphis, but didn't get a chance to respond until now... I've never been a big fan of block, but so far this seems on I could have gotten into. While it is annoying how fast infect can be I like the Mindslaver deck you got. Oh and of course the Venser one is awesome, I got excited after showing a few of my own, he's quickly become my favorite planeswalker! I'm still waiting to see someone put together the UW list with say Venser, Gideon, and Sunblast Angel for std though...
Hey everyone, I want to sincerely thank you all for the support, as I mentioned though Paul the collection is already dead and gone as of yesterday so it is a complete wipe.
I do want to extend a lot of thanks to blau who helped me come up and craft this new idea and I think it'll be fantastic, imagine if you will one of those reality tv shows Undercover Boss, Survivor, The Colony, or even Wife Swap. I'll be taken completely out of my element, given a set of rules of survival, and we'll see how it goes. I've almost completed the first article for it that gives all the information and I think people will get as much enjoyment out of reading it as I will writing it. It is a huge change to go from tons of play time to very little and from money.dec to budget.dec, but it'll only add to the appeal of some of the things I've got planned. I do want to thank everyone I've talked to about this tough move recently because everyone has inspired me in some way to not totally leave and instead issue this new creative series. The Pure readers and writers are really a great community of people.
Side note I'm really irritated with my list of cards to blink lol I should have spell checked closer to make it pretty. Esp Realm Razor, please please please someone build a deck with him and Venser cuz that'd be too awesome! He's in play all lands removed, on your turn you use venser to remove him and have your lands, play and he comes back at the end removing lands for your opponents turn.
dude, nice come back!
i think the only real difference draft wise i would have done is taken perilous myr over turn to slag, pack 1, pick 6. i also, apparently, underrate heart stoker. i forget it turns on trainee and there are a few other random interactions that are cute.
I think I have to side with Peter here. The issue he raises is simple. Lying about the price of cards is ripping people off. No, you are not entitled to rip someone off because you looked up the values of the cards.
If both parties agree to the same pricing system, like a particular website, then both parties know what their card's "value" is according to that site.
I think it's fair for a trader to make a proffit based upon arbitration, like being able to pick up a card for .75 on one site then trading it at 1.50 according to another system while the cards he gets are valued lower on that site. Speculation is also fine. Or if the trading partner is ok with losing value in order to get the cards he needs. But lying about the prices of cards is wrong. A few weeks ago I saw someone tell their trading partner that the value of their Molten-tail Masticore was $8.00. No system ever valued it that low, and I nearly reported the person to the store owner. That's pretty close to stealing. He didn't say "I value it at $8", he said "it's going for $8", and I happen to know that this person knows better. That is the type of trading for proffit that is frowned upon here.
I must resist the urge...I just realized how good trinket mage into Everflowing chalice would be...or into voltaic key, and i really want to build a Liquimetal Coating deck...must resist the dark side of magic, i cannot go to the islands...
And then you create another account..... as there is no IP blocking just user accounts.
That is also assuming the bot owners actually notice. You would be surprised how slack many are (both in code and maintenance).
You could until the bot owner realized what you were doing and started refusing your trade offers.
How do you find the Standard Daily Event results/deck lists?
I have seen them referenced and linked several times, but I can't find them on MTGdaily.
Great article...the archetype list is very valuable info. Thanks.
Very interesting article
I would like to add my 2.5c here:
Time / Money - You mention this that you could spend less time working for more money/tix - which is true on one facet. The other facet is that not all people can pick up extra work/income as wanted, and likewise jobs are a responsibility - and hence often are required minimum hours/days. Essentially meaning you could be committing to a lot more to earn - or in some case have a inability to. Not only that when you work could result in no MTGO when your peers play. Just food for thought.
Behaviour / Accessibility - I find it interesting that this is not raised as heavily as for me it is moreso a price driver in that if a bot is open and available (and not lag to s#$t) then it has a infinitely higher chance than one which is constantly interrupted of making people $$. One example I explained to a friend was the fact a BOT does not decriminate as to who, how many, how long trades are with people. Essentially you could continually lock up certain bots from being available to trade - in order to force the market where to go.
.*
Our-Lord-Erman,
Certianly some good explorations of block possibilities here.
I think you're right about green black having major mana problems with only one set out, and aggro doesn't need more hands that just lose due to mana (too much, not enough, + wrong colors) having to mull even more is just too much no matter how ridiculous Putrefax is, (have you considered mono-green infect? Maybe there aren't enough good cards for it)
I kind of prefer the old mindslaver art, glad I had a couple of the older ones to sell off for tix for a little xtra cash.
Precursor Golem just seems too fragile to me, out of the sideboard vs some decks he could probably be great though.
X-
I play Green/White often enough. But I am a 5c mage.
anyone else find it interesting people are always quick to rush and say "im a blue/red/black mage" yet white and green are never usually in that list
thx man I really appreciate it, fyi to anyone who may have me on their buddy list I have a new account PoorMansMagic that I put together if wizards customer service ever fixes it lol when I'm drafting and stuff you'll find me on that name as opposed to JustSin
ah weak, you're right
Basically, the B&R list is empty. So might as well phrase what it does say in an amusing manner. Bear in mind commander is a singleton format.
for realm razer i do believe you need to add a third piece like amulet of vigor. otherwise the lands come back in tapped.
Red's been rubbish since Browbeat rotated out of almost everything.
Who's with me? Nobody? Darn.
Dang, so sad to see you go dude. I probably have several extra pauper cards in order for you to make a competitive deck, hit me up online if you are interested. For awhile I was playing competitive pauper, but it really isn't my cup of tea to be honest so as long as I don't need the cards for legacy, you are welcome to have some.
In a nutshell, here is the biggest problem people face while trying to turn small profits online.
Quote: "You might even get lucky offering it at $46 if you wait long enough. However, if you want to get into another draft, and selling that Megahype Walletslayer is what will get you the TIX and packs to get in, waiting for hours is probably not an option."
Most people lack patience. I recently wrote in my last article that newer players lack patience in their game play, but this is also very true for trading in both paper and MTGO. I know it is hard to believe, but I remember buying Jace, TMS at around 32 tickets and selling them for 36. I did this several times in the same day with little to no effort. The only people who can honestly turn profits to make it worth their time are the bigger dealers. They have the resources to stay ontop of all the price changes and even speculation. For those of us doing small trading, just trying to turn small profits can be done with just a little bit of good old fashioned patience!
good read
I'm fairly new to MTGO, so I'm curious as to how popular block constructed really is online. In paper, there are GP's and such that dictate a healthy interest in block constructed, are there any such events like that on MODO, or is the highest level of support daily events or 2/8-man queues?
With the current QP season having just ended online, what cards would you speculate on now as being potential sleepers?
AJ!,
Hey guys another great episode, I'm really looking forward to what MED4 brings us, interesting that if you hold down shift while typing "4" you get "$", and if any power is in MED4 one imagines it will make tons and tons of "$" for wizards. Did they every say they wouldn't introduce mythics into MED4?, oh man Mythic power cards, ok this chain of thought is just getting worse and worse I have to stop.
It was great having AJ at our event this weekend, interestingly one of the other 18 contestants copied his deck for the most part and played him in round one after having play tested against him, AJ got the better of the mirror in any case. Strange to see 2 of the same deck in one event when the deck hasn't appeared at all before.
Just wanted to clear up the price points, which of course you don't actually have to know since the Heirloom Legal Card List is static once made and you should just refer to that. The cutoffs are based on 2.5x the minimum cost for each rarity on Mtgotraders. At that we winded up with $0.05 cents for a common $0.10 for an uncommon $0.20 for a rare and $1.00 for a Mythic. Most decks cost less than $4.00 altogether.
X-
I think the comparison to the stock market radically exaggerates the difficulty of predicting price fluctuations in Magic, which has very predictable cycles. While I agree with you that speculating on a specific card to get hot based on a tournament performance is in fact quite challenging unless you are very well connected at the high levels of professional magic, speculating in a broader sense is quite easy. Back when I played IRL I put maybe $300-500 into my magic collection including the cost of tournament entries. Three or so years later I sold my collection on Ebay for over $3000, and that was a "sell to a dealer" price. And I certainly was no Medina on the trade floor. I typically only traded with friends at college and then at tournaments I'd attend (typically 3-5 per year -- the three prereleases and maybe a couple of Grand Prix Trials or PTQs), and I didn't try to rip people off or speculate on particular cards. I usually was trading for things I wanted or things that I thought I might want in the future. I never entertained the idea of "binder momentum" or whatever.
What I did do was trade for standard cards during extended season and extended cards during standard season (especially right around rotation time when cards rotating out of standard dramatically drop in price and people are eager to unload them). When cards I had did get hot I'd trade them off for staple cards that were more likely to maintain their value over time.
I agree that the market is a bit more complex now as there are more people speculating now than before, and the changes to tournament formats have altered the cycles a bit from what they used to be -- but I'd argue that it's still a relatively predictable pattern.
Great I appreciate the break down, I had considered it a worthless card, but now I'm a bit more inclined to take it even as great sideboard material, and yea thanks I never even though about Soliton, that's a great way to use it!
I read this article on my phone during the long drive to Memphis, but didn't get a chance to respond until now... I've never been a big fan of block, but so far this seems on I could have gotten into. While it is annoying how fast infect can be I like the Mindslaver deck you got. Oh and of course the Venser one is awesome, I got excited after showing a few of my own, he's quickly become my favorite planeswalker! I'm still waiting to see someone put together the UW list with say Venser, Gideon, and Sunblast Angel for std though...
Hey everyone, I want to sincerely thank you all for the support, as I mentioned though Paul the collection is already dead and gone as of yesterday so it is a complete wipe.
I do want to extend a lot of thanks to blau who helped me come up and craft this new idea and I think it'll be fantastic, imagine if you will one of those reality tv shows Undercover Boss, Survivor, The Colony, or even Wife Swap. I'll be taken completely out of my element, given a set of rules of survival, and we'll see how it goes. I've almost completed the first article for it that gives all the information and I think people will get as much enjoyment out of reading it as I will writing it. It is a huge change to go from tons of play time to very little and from money.dec to budget.dec, but it'll only add to the appeal of some of the things I've got planned. I do want to thank everyone I've talked to about this tough move recently because everyone has inspired me in some way to not totally leave and instead issue this new creative series. The Pure readers and writers are really a great community of people.
Side note I'm really irritated with my list of cards to blink lol I should have spell checked closer to make it pretty. Esp Realm Razor, please please please someone build a deck with him and Venser cuz that'd be too awesome! He's in play all lands removed, on your turn you use venser to remove him and have your lands, play and he comes back at the end removing lands for your opponents turn.
dude, nice come back!
i think the only real difference draft wise i would have done is taken perilous myr over turn to slag, pack 1, pick 6. i also, apparently, underrate heart stoker. i forget it turns on trainee and there are a few other random interactions that are cute.