They stated in their blog that they will be having another war mark event sometime in july basically due to the fact that these ones filled up.
EDIT: this was in reply to the previous poster, not used to this comment system or replying on my phone. Sorry
I'm pretty disappointed that the War Mark Events are all full. They did add some more events to for Saturday but they capped the events at 256 people while the Philly PTQ is still capped at 512. I don't know why they didn't make the war mark events on demand or extend the capacity for the events.
I didn't know what to expect from a Textcast compared to a podcast, but I realy liked the acurate formating and all the links and decklists - Thanks a lot!!
Fore those who want to handle the card pool more comfortable while brewing a deck, use the advanced search on this site
I posted last week, the june mopr cards were posted in the may 24th blog on the mtgo group on the wizards site. The cards are wild mongrel, gatekeeper, full-art cancel and full-art DoJ
I know Blind Zealot isn't fantastic in an artifact block, but I still think you undervalue him, especially when you should have been looking to cut black after opening an Enslave. I certainly think its better than Kiln Walker.
Also, Peace Strider over Dross Ripper. You just want to hit the late game, the 3 life is very relevant both for stalling and offsetting Phyrexian Mana costs.
I also don't agree with the last Spin Engine over Ogre Resister. Ogre can be very very difficult to attack through, while Engine can get picked off by basically any of the deal 1 damage or give -1/-1 counter cards, and you aren't looking to aggro them out.
Lastly, I think Crush over Myr Welder and Kuldotha Rebirth over Flesh Allergy (when you have a Perilous Myr, even) were just straight up mis-picks.
Here is how I go about testing a deck that is new to me. I start out in the TP room just to get a feel for how it plays out and to see the synergies. Granted the competition isn't always the best in there, but I have found that the Legacy players in that room are overall better then most of the players of Standard.
In those games I found out a lot about the deck, including how it played out against a lot of the aggro decks. Elves, Goblins, Affinity, etc...
I faced one UW deck in the TP room and beat it pretty easily. After shoring up some of those matches I thought I was ready to go to the next level of testing in the 2 mans.
It was in the two mans that I faced a barrage of UW Stoneblade decks. In those matchups I really came to see some of the decks weaknesses. What I found was that Dark Horizons relies on early disruption and then beating down with a fatty. If the opposing deck could stop that disruption then it became a lot harder to stop them.
The UW decks are really good with thwarting that early disription. Mental Misstep stops thoughtseize and Top. Brainstorm does a great job of protecting the two best spells they have in their hand when you cast Hymn. At first I thought they were brainstorming for a counter, but then it dawned on me that it was better for them to hide their best cards then to counter.
Spell Snare stops almost every other threat in the deck. While there are a lot more threats then they have Spell Snares, disrupting your 2nd turn play is brutal. They also run Daze. In the end, these spells disrupt your plan of disrupting their plans. This gives them a tempo advantage and their attrition plan is far better than what you can do.
This is not to say that my deck can not beat as I fell the match up is pretty good if just not slightly more favorable for them.
I was not able to play the deck in any Dailies as they just did not fire on time. To devote 3-4 hours for a tournament I have to plan it around the time my youngest kids go to bed and the hours at which my play starts to suffer as I am old and tired=)Which gets earlier and earlier.
I probably played about 15 two mans. While it is not the greatest sample size it gave me enough information to see that this deck is no longer a good fit for me. I enjoy casting Hymn, but I also like countering stuff. So the next deck will probably be the Bant deck, but the UWB deck looks good as well.
I hope this clears things up. I do plan on writing more about Legacy, but again it will be slow going.
I have an article that I have restarted about 4 times now talking about how to analyze play mistakes. Again writing about more than just looking at your replays is difficult. One day it will see the light of day though.
Hi. Ultimately, while I think the deck could have some pretty good games, I don't think it could work consistently enough for me to want to pilot it in a tournament, mainly due to your last comments about the mana.
The Jund mana is just horrible (not yours in particular, just the general framework). In terms of 10 Forest, 9 Mountain, 4 Swamp, this helps you get the RRR part of Violent Ultimatum, but having 13 non-Green sources means that you will often times be stuck with several mana fixers and no access to Green mana. The solution would be to cut a few Mountain and go up to maybe 12-13 Forest. But then you run into mana issues the other way, i.e. not being able to cast your bombs timely.
Also, having to use and rely on 10-12 mana-fixers is both a blessing and a curse. It's great in Turns 2-4, but when you topdeck a Rampant Growth or Farhaven Elf in the late game, it feels horrible. Once you have your mana base set, whatever is left of the dozen fixers are basically pseudo-lands. So even though you've already put 7-10 land into play, your mana-to-spell ratio is still probably close to 40%, which explains the late-game flooding when your bombs fail to win the game immediately and the game goes long.
Moreover, starting with less than 40%, in this case 38%, with an average CMC of 3-4+ is a recipe for mana screw for at least 10-20% of all games.
In theory, I think replacing the discard elements (4 Blightning 1 Mind Rot) with 5 Elf Lords is a viable strategy. Although, the Elf count is pretty low. And without a plethora of Elves, Perfect is still good, but Champ is just an over-costed bear (there will be games where you will draw 1-2 Champ, 1-2 Rampant, 0 Elves). But the main reason why I like to play Jund, other than its fantastic bombs, is Blightning. This is probably why I like B/R Discard more than Jund.
As a frequent writer of Legacy on pure, let me first start by saying I am glad to see you writing about the format. I agree with some of Hammers points, but not all.
I think it is easy to say this deck folds to deck x, or this deck owns deck y, but in the end I believe as a writer, we need to show data to this effect and not just make broad statements as such.
I've seen you wandering around the TP room and while I'm assuming here, I'm going to say you probably did little to no tournament testing with the deck (2mans or DE's). The reason I am coming to that assumption is because goblins hasn't seen consistent tournament play in awhile. The only time you ever face goblins is in the TP room. Affinity is always in the TP room and occassionally in the 2mans, but not so much in the Daily events or at least not enough to make it a consistent problem. Dredge is always in the TP room and rears its' ugly head in 2mans and dailys as well. Of those 3 decks, dredge probably sees the most consistent competitive play, followed by affinity, then goblins imo.
I'd love to see you continue the series and not only continue it, but continue working on the decklist you posted. As a matter of fact, I'm only a few cards shy of your list and I might give it a trial run tonight.
In regards to the Dark Horizans V2 - I think Sword of Feast and Famine should be maindeck, it is much better than body and mind imo. Also, 23 lands and 3 Mox Diamonds seems clunky to me. Have you tried lowering the land count to 21 or 22? Maze seems bad to me as your creatures should be bigger than everyone elses most of the time. If you are worried about Emrakul, that is why you have karakas. Two pridemage in the sb seems bad as well without green sun zenith. I'd cut them for Krosan grip which is better against more decks, like ones running batterskull or stupid affinity.
I have tons of more comments to make about your deck, not because I'm being over critical, but because I like it and think it could be better. Unfortunately, I'm at work and running short on time.
Last thing I'll say is this: What is the first focus of your deck, is it a control first or beatdown first? What is the correct turn 1 or 2 play, Dark Confidant or Stoneforge Mystic?
I hope you keep writing and I hope you expand on this decklist and not wander off somewhere else. If you do try that bant list (I've been playing it alot) you will find it very fun to play and you won't be dissapointed.
I hope my comments didn't come off as I didn't think he played enough...I was merely stating it would take huge amounts of play testing to get the hang of, so it's natural to have some ideas/thoughts/conclusions that are less than accurate.. that's not an indictment, just a statement. I do like the progression from "budget" player and look forward to him working up and injecting money into the deck to see how that fares, to me that is the most important part.
actually green does this for creatures quite a lot; e.g. lurking predators, call of the wild, game preserve, etc.
The red aspect of killer instinct is the haste, and the saccing at the end of the turn. Lopping creatures straight off the top of the library is usually green, methinks.
I'm making a deck using only Pack 1 and am currently testing a hybrid of your elves/Jund. Basically a combo with aggro elves (Elvish Champion, Imperious Perfect) with mana finders (Farhaven, Wayfinder, Rampant Growth) to get to the bombs (Hellkite Overlord, Flameblast Dragon, Broodmate Dragon). Could this deck work, and do you have any thoughts on what your version might look like? I've packed in some removal through Terrors, Shock/Incinerate, and Naturalize (with Violent Ultimatum too), but never seem to get to the Naturalize against the mill decks. Otherwise, it's been good in testing, but I've gotten mana screwed/flooded a decent amount of times (running 10 Forests, 9 Mountains, 4 Swamps).
"I do plan on doing a Part 3, but it will have to wait as I am kind of done with this deck. My goal, as stated in the first article, will be looking at going more towards a deck with blue in it. I can't deny that those are the most powerful."
Personally I primarily enjoy the experience of your journey (figuring out what you can build and what you can play and what you want to eventual start playing, discussing strategy changes, testing the changes, feeling out the metagame, rundown on trading to get cards you need, general thoughts, etc.) and your presentation the most.
I'd actually you prefer mixing up decklists (especially to get to what you want). That way we get to see you tinker with various decks/builds and get a bite of the meta from different angles.
"Legacy is going to be a long term thing for me and will be slow going, but I will get there."
Looking forward to it. I appreciate the long stretches of playtime that fall between each article. Gives them a much more thorough/experienced focus and more substance to relate.
Thanks for the comments! I am glad that you enjoyed the articles...both of them.
I do plan on doing a Part 3, but it will have to wait as I am kind of done with this deck. My goal, as stated in the first article, will be looking at going more towards a deck with blue in it. I can't deny that those are the most powerful.
Legacy is going to be a long term thing for me and will be slow going, but I will get there.
My Turn: I put your Comments in "double quotes" and my replies in 'single quotes and bold'.
"p1p3 melira is an odd pick. Its just not that strong a card, better in sb. Suture priest is the easy call there, its on color, and gets you to late game for cenobite."
'I acknowledged that in the draft that the Outcast was odd. What I guess I didn’t say was that I knew it at the time and was more than fine with the pick. If I hadn’t made that oddball pick…. Spire Monitor, Blighted Agent, or Vault Skirge would have been my pick. Even the Probe or the Raptor were options. That makes Suture Priest sixth on my hypothetical list. How does he help me get there? If he is allowed to stick around because Opponent doesn’t want to waste removal then does he even perform as well as a Bleakcoven Vamp? That is does he ever give you that four point swing? I doubt it. There is so much collateral damage in this set, that he will die when Opponent chooses. He is on color. I’ll give you that, but I don’t think he is as amazing as some many people claim him to be.'
"p1p5 the souleater is another odd pick. Its off color, and not even that great in blue. The talisman gets you to cenobite, accelerates you and gains you life."
'If it is off color, and I just passed enough blue to suggest that perhaps it wasn’t, then we once again disagree on the worth of a card. Somehow, he always gets the job done for me and against me. It is the same job the Invisimancer had, and wasn’t too great at because of one toughness. Even as an artifact, he is more survivable. It combos very nicely with the Necropouncer as I stated in the draft. The Talisman is my next pick. I know its good, but there are two packs worth of acceleration to look forward to. I like your pick, I just like mine, too.'
"p1p7 the exarch is amazing in fast aggro decks, not so much in decks planning to play 7 drops. Forced worship is not too great, but still probably the pick."
'At this point I know I’m playing the Cenobite, Necropouncer, and Porcelain Legionnaire. Which ever pick I make here, I am 80% sure I will run. Mediocre removal or mediocre creature? You are probably correct, but I wanted to start filling in low-drops and hope for better removal. Would you pick Bonds of Quicksilver this early? Nope. Forced Worship is better than that, but very similar. I’m already going for the win, and to win I will need better removal than this.'
"p2p5 Dross ripper sucks, even when playing black. At that point you have one black card that isnt worth splashing, and multiple green cards/blue cards. Copper carapace or mirran mettle wouldve been the pick."
'I disagree that Dross Ripper Sucks. I strongly disagree that it sucks when in Black. I disagree that the Imp is not worth splashing. At his point I am WU maybe splashing Green, and unlikely splashing Black. I won’t splash for Mirran Mettle and I do not want Copper Carapace for this deck. Despite all of my arguments so far, we have been very close to agreeing with everything so far, but not this… not by a mile.'
"Dude, you've got to stop doing things like:
P1P4: "Not happy to have such a high curve so far!"
P1P5: *Takes mediocre Souleater over PRISTINE TALISMAN to accelerate/buy time*
Taking Exarch over Forced Worship, in a deck that wants nothing else (to that point) but to get to the late game, doesn't seem correct either. Any particular reason for that?"
'Both answered above.'
"Past that - fun draft, some awkward SOM opens for sure. I think you should have staked claim to either U or G earlier, but it worked out fine, and shows how NMS really rewards staying open."
'Thanks, I hope the videos made it fun. Go through the first pack again. My only chances to stake claim to Blue any earlier were the Spire Monitor P1P3 over the Green Outcast and the Souleater P1P5. Oh wait, I did take the Souleater there. . There were no Green choices better than White. I think I got into Blue at just the right time, and cut it pretty hard in pack 2.'
"Videos look pretty slick. Sound isnt that big a deal for me. The notes are nice, a lot of typos, but a good touch. Overall a big improvement on the last draft you posted."
'Thanks. I noticed one typo, “Go for the Throat,” but was far to sick of the whole process to look out for them all. Now that I have an understanding of the process, I can spend more time on the typos. I also guessed that I misspelled Oculus a bunch of times.'
"R1:G1 8:25 Opp at 2 with 2 blockers, you have 4 1/1's. 9:40 Opp at 2 with 2 blockers, you have 4 1/1's."
'Look again. I had three creatures that could attack, Perilous Myr (which I acknowledged should have attacked) Oculus, and Copper Myr. Suture Priest had just come in. If I swung with the team, I am poisoned by the Reaper, and the Throatseeker is unleashed. Attacking with the team was one way to lose. Not attacking with the Myr was an obvious mistake. But again, I acknowledged that.'
"Playing land you can't possibly need immediately after drawing it is just terrible. Why give your opponent more information? At least wait until after combat."
'Again, I pointed that out myself.'
"You play extremely conservatively with perilous myr and necropouncer/just getting in there multiple times. This is highlighted in R1/2. I'm not even going to mess with your other possible errors in judgement."
'I’m still trying to find what you might be talking about here. But so far, you have only pointed out things that I have pointed out myself.'
"Your opponents make an insane amount of on board misplays."
'I pointed that out as well.'
"I guess I just don't see what makes this draft particularly relevant."
'!?!'
"Author is rather fresh MTG player (have less then 2 years of experience).
So, huge amount of mistakes is OK.
Bad thing is that he does not notice his mistakes after long time spent on editing videos."
'It sounds like you are commenting on the comments of others. Did you find any mistakes? Ones I didn’t find? So far, nobody has other than my ‘overvaluing’ of Trespassing Souleater.'
Mutagenic Growth, Phyrexian Jugger, Spine Bitter, Rot Wolf, Blightwidow. And, I've only seen 14 cards to this point. He has two heavy hitter finishers in the Jugger and Spine Biter, and I didn't want the infect count to get too high from the little guy just to have his finishers come out and give me one turn to deal with them or else.
I REALLY LIKED the article. In fact, I really liked BOTH articles in the series.
I don't check out all that many articles on PureMtGO, and the ones I do look at I often skim. I actually read (no skimming) both of the "My Plunge into Online Legacy" articles.
I don't find them rambling or half-baked in terms of their structure or content. I find the content well organized and formatted.
I also don't get the other poster's criticism about his playtesting "evidence". Evidence? His wording makes it very clear to me that he plays a lot of games and tests out cards (including suggestions by others) within his playtesting to address specific encountered problem areas and then see how effective the changes prove to be. He even mentions trends in whats showing up in the meta and how that influenced decisions. And it's not like he playtested a couple games one night and wrote the follow-up article on results the next day: it's been 20-days between articles.
To me, this series so far is about a guy who decided to play non-casual Legacy on MTGO ("take the plunge") and he's giving us a full blow-by-blow breakdown on the different things he's encountering on his journey:
* where he came from (Magic-wise)
* why he took the plunge
* what he had expected, what he found
* how he is making deckbuilding decisions/changes with strategy, playstyle preference, and transition budget* in mind.
I REALLY HOPE he CONTINUES with this EXACT format and series.
I dip my feet in MTGO Legacy from time to time and am curious about the scene. I also like to know what a player new MTGO Legacy is encountering. I also like to see this kind of article as a gentle push (to join) to those on the fence about making the plunge from paper to online or from other online formats to online Legacy.
Mr. Author: Please keep doing the exact thing you are doing. I don't want draft rundowns (I have no interest in limited), I don't need video articles (they can be fine for showing how a specific matchup or new deck type is played, but they are so narrow/limited in terms of communicating deck evolution compared to the concise synopsis style you provide now.), etc.
What I want is "My Plunge into Online Legacy Pt. 3" (with another ~20 day period of playtesting in-between articles to give you a ton of great insight/experience/journey/tinkering content)
More Please :)
--
* transition budget - as a competitive player, I dislike people trying to play Legacy with budget decks or swap out key cards of good decks with weaker budget versions and be done with it. But here the author is making it clear that he is attempting to try to play with the best deck he can afford (that is also in-line with his playstyle preference), and then we get to see how that goes, and then he assures us he will be modding the deck as he injects cash into it. That is doubly great for me since (1) we get to see how a player (new to MTGO Legacy) trying to crack the format on a transition budget fares, (2) because he is not trying to half-a*s it, but is going full Spike playtest-wise, and (3) we know he is going to ramp it up to be full non-budget.
Personally I think that the drawback would be more playable if it was 'You skip you're draw step' the third ability is 'Pay 3 life : Draw a card'.
In terms of the drawback, I think that it makes the card more open to general use, because it lets you use Brainstorm style draw and return cards, which would be key to making this comboable and interesting. Indeed any other draw effects which you practically need in a combo deck are dead once the enchantment is down. As it stands yes you can ponder and preordain but without getting a card makes it a bit brutal. Particularly, since you had diving tops in mind, it seems weird that you sacrifice half the card. If you just skip the draw step, you can use diving top to combo for card advantage (draw a card and put diving top on top of your library in your opponents EoT... oh how convenient a permanent on top).
Paying 3 life each to draw through your library in hopes of a game winner makes me a little unhappy and you should be able to use mana to do that too even if only through other cards.
Other than that, the concept has real potential if you have the inclination. Deciever Exarch + this + fatty = glee. Hell if you want to try that route you could maybe play a successful BUG/Lotus cobra variant.
I'm happy you liked it Nagarjuna.
Actually after watching recent pro events I totally agree, thanks for the comment!
Nice to finally see this go up, hope people enjoy it.
They stated in their blog that they will be having another war mark event sometime in july basically due to the fact that these ones filled up.
EDIT: this was in reply to the previous poster, not used to this comment system or replying on my phone. Sorry
I'm pretty disappointed that the War Mark Events are all full. They did add some more events to for Saturday but they capped the events at 256 people while the Philly PTQ is still capped at 512. I don't know why they didn't make the war mark events on demand or extend the capacity for the events.
Hey guys!
I didn't know what to expect from a Textcast compared to a podcast, but I realy liked the acurate formating and all the links and decklists - Thanks a lot!!
Fore those who want to handle the card pool more comfortable while brewing a deck, use the advanced search on this site
http://tappedout.net/mtg-cards/search/?subtype__name=&mana_cost_converte...
You can search Heirloom legal cards with atributes like Type, Subtype, Cost, Rules etc.
Some cards like Hypergenesis just got banned so I expect to see brand new decks soon in the meta!!
Good work guys
I posted last week, the june mopr cards were posted in the may 24th blog on the mtgo group on the wizards site. The cards are wild mongrel, gatekeeper, full-art cancel and full-art DoJ
I know Blind Zealot isn't fantastic in an artifact block, but I still think you undervalue him, especially when you should have been looking to cut black after opening an Enslave. I certainly think its better than Kiln Walker.
Also, Peace Strider over Dross Ripper. You just want to hit the late game, the 3 life is very relevant both for stalling and offsetting Phyrexian Mana costs.
I also don't agree with the last Spin Engine over Ogre Resister. Ogre can be very very difficult to attack through, while Engine can get picked off by basically any of the deal 1 damage or give -1/-1 counter cards, and you aren't looking to aggro them out.
Lastly, I think Crush over Myr Welder and Kuldotha Rebirth over Flesh Allergy (when you have a Perilous Myr, even) were just straight up mis-picks.
Thanks for the comments!
Here is how I go about testing a deck that is new to me. I start out in the TP room just to get a feel for how it plays out and to see the synergies. Granted the competition isn't always the best in there, but I have found that the Legacy players in that room are overall better then most of the players of Standard.
In those games I found out a lot about the deck, including how it played out against a lot of the aggro decks. Elves, Goblins, Affinity, etc...
I faced one UW deck in the TP room and beat it pretty easily. After shoring up some of those matches I thought I was ready to go to the next level of testing in the 2 mans.
It was in the two mans that I faced a barrage of UW Stoneblade decks. In those matchups I really came to see some of the decks weaknesses. What I found was that Dark Horizons relies on early disruption and then beating down with a fatty. If the opposing deck could stop that disruption then it became a lot harder to stop them.
The UW decks are really good with thwarting that early disription. Mental Misstep stops thoughtseize and Top. Brainstorm does a great job of protecting the two best spells they have in their hand when you cast Hymn. At first I thought they were brainstorming for a counter, but then it dawned on me that it was better for them to hide their best cards then to counter.
Spell Snare stops almost every other threat in the deck. While there are a lot more threats then they have Spell Snares, disrupting your 2nd turn play is brutal. They also run Daze. In the end, these spells disrupt your plan of disrupting their plans. This gives them a tempo advantage and their attrition plan is far better than what you can do.
This is not to say that my deck can not beat as I fell the match up is pretty good if just not slightly more favorable for them.
I was not able to play the deck in any Dailies as they just did not fire on time. To devote 3-4 hours for a tournament I have to plan it around the time my youngest kids go to bed and the hours at which my play starts to suffer as I am old and tired=)Which gets earlier and earlier.
I probably played about 15 two mans. While it is not the greatest sample size it gave me enough information to see that this deck is no longer a good fit for me. I enjoy casting Hymn, but I also like countering stuff. So the next deck will probably be the Bant deck, but the UWB deck looks good as well.
I hope this clears things up. I do plan on writing more about Legacy, but again it will be slow going.
I have an article that I have restarted about 4 times now talking about how to analyze play mistakes. Again writing about more than just looking at your replays is difficult. One day it will see the light of day though.
Thanks everyone for the comments. I'm glad you liked the decks, the article and the project as a whole.
LE
Hi. Ultimately, while I think the deck could have some pretty good games, I don't think it could work consistently enough for me to want to pilot it in a tournament, mainly due to your last comments about the mana.
The Jund mana is just horrible (not yours in particular, just the general framework). In terms of 10 Forest, 9 Mountain, 4 Swamp, this helps you get the RRR part of Violent Ultimatum, but having 13 non-Green sources means that you will often times be stuck with several mana fixers and no access to Green mana. The solution would be to cut a few Mountain and go up to maybe 12-13 Forest. But then you run into mana issues the other way, i.e. not being able to cast your bombs timely.
Also, having to use and rely on 10-12 mana-fixers is both a blessing and a curse. It's great in Turns 2-4, but when you topdeck a Rampant Growth or Farhaven Elf in the late game, it feels horrible. Once you have your mana base set, whatever is left of the dozen fixers are basically pseudo-lands. So even though you've already put 7-10 land into play, your mana-to-spell ratio is still probably close to 40%, which explains the late-game flooding when your bombs fail to win the game immediately and the game goes long.
Moreover, starting with less than 40%, in this case 38%, with an average CMC of 3-4+ is a recipe for mana screw for at least 10-20% of all games.
In theory, I think replacing the discard elements (4 Blightning 1 Mind Rot) with 5 Elf Lords is a viable strategy. Although, the Elf count is pretty low. And without a plethora of Elves, Perfect is still good, but Champ is just an over-costed bear (there will be games where you will draw 1-2 Champ, 1-2 Rampant, 0 Elves). But the main reason why I like to play Jund, other than its fantastic bombs, is Blightning. This is probably why I like B/R Discard more than Jund.
As a frequent writer of Legacy on pure, let me first start by saying I am glad to see you writing about the format. I agree with some of Hammers points, but not all.
I think it is easy to say this deck folds to deck x, or this deck owns deck y, but in the end I believe as a writer, we need to show data to this effect and not just make broad statements as such.
I've seen you wandering around the TP room and while I'm assuming here, I'm going to say you probably did little to no tournament testing with the deck (2mans or DE's). The reason I am coming to that assumption is because goblins hasn't seen consistent tournament play in awhile. The only time you ever face goblins is in the TP room. Affinity is always in the TP room and occassionally in the 2mans, but not so much in the Daily events or at least not enough to make it a consistent problem. Dredge is always in the TP room and rears its' ugly head in 2mans and dailys as well. Of those 3 decks, dredge probably sees the most consistent competitive play, followed by affinity, then goblins imo.
I'd love to see you continue the series and not only continue it, but continue working on the decklist you posted. As a matter of fact, I'm only a few cards shy of your list and I might give it a trial run tonight.
In regards to the Dark Horizans V2 - I think Sword of Feast and Famine should be maindeck, it is much better than body and mind imo. Also, 23 lands and 3 Mox Diamonds seems clunky to me. Have you tried lowering the land count to 21 or 22? Maze seems bad to me as your creatures should be bigger than everyone elses most of the time. If you are worried about Emrakul, that is why you have karakas. Two pridemage in the sb seems bad as well without green sun zenith. I'd cut them for Krosan grip which is better against more decks, like ones running batterskull or stupid affinity.
I have tons of more comments to make about your deck, not because I'm being over critical, but because I like it and think it could be better. Unfortunately, I'm at work and running short on time.
Last thing I'll say is this: What is the first focus of your deck, is it a control first or beatdown first? What is the correct turn 1 or 2 play, Dark Confidant or Stoneforge Mystic?
I hope you keep writing and I hope you expand on this decklist and not wander off somewhere else. If you do try that bant list (I've been playing it alot) you will find it very fun to play and you won't be dissapointed.
See you around
-ImpinAintEasy-
Amazing job balancing your decks, I am impressed.
It reads like a fun and rewarding project.
I hope my comments didn't come off as I didn't think he played enough...I was merely stating it would take huge amounts of play testing to get the hang of, so it's natural to have some ideas/thoughts/conclusions that are less than accurate.. that's not an indictment, just a statement. I do like the progression from "budget" player and look forward to him working up and injecting money into the deck to see how that fares, to me that is the most important part.
actually green does this for creatures quite a lot; e.g. lurking predators, call of the wild, game preserve, etc.
The red aspect of killer instinct is the haste, and the saccing at the end of the turn. Lopping creatures straight off the top of the library is usually green, methinks.
they did actually give it to everyone who was qualified
@Kumagoro42 not everyone wants to get the Momir avatar. Did WotC offer that for free so everyone could join the event?
I'm making a deck using only Pack 1 and am currently testing a hybrid of your elves/Jund. Basically a combo with aggro elves (Elvish Champion, Imperious Perfect) with mana finders (Farhaven, Wayfinder, Rampant Growth) to get to the bombs (Hellkite Overlord, Flameblast Dragon, Broodmate Dragon). Could this deck work, and do you have any thoughts on what your version might look like? I've packed in some removal through Terrors, Shock/Incinerate, and Naturalize (with Violent Ultimatum too), but never seem to get to the Naturalize against the mill decks. Otherwise, it's been good in testing, but I've gotten mana screwed/flooded a decent amount of times (running 10 Forests, 9 Mountains, 4 Swamps).
"I do plan on doing a Part 3, but it will have to wait as I am kind of done with this deck. My goal, as stated in the first article, will be looking at going more towards a deck with blue in it. I can't deny that those are the most powerful."
Personally I primarily enjoy the experience of your journey (figuring out what you can build and what you can play and what you want to eventual start playing, discussing strategy changes, testing the changes, feeling out the metagame, rundown on trading to get cards you need, general thoughts, etc.) and your presentation the most.
I'd actually you prefer mixing up decklists (especially to get to what you want). That way we get to see you tinker with various decks/builds and get a bite of the meta from different angles.
"Legacy is going to be a long term thing for me and will be slow going, but I will get there."
Looking forward to it. I appreciate the long stretches of playtime that fall between each article. Gives them a much more thorough/experienced focus and more substance to relate.
Thanks for the comments! I am glad that you enjoyed the articles...both of them.
I do plan on doing a Part 3, but it will have to wait as I am kind of done with this deck. My goal, as stated in the first article, will be looking at going more towards a deck with blue in it. I can't deny that those are the most powerful.
Legacy is going to be a long term thing for me and will be slow going, but I will get there.
Don
Thanks. I fixed it. I didn't know I could use html tags and I ended up using the blank tag.
My Turn: I put your Comments in "double quotes" and my replies in 'single quotes and bold'.
"p1p3 melira is an odd pick. Its just not that strong a card, better in sb. Suture priest is the easy call there, its on color, and gets you to late game for cenobite."
'I acknowledged that in the draft that the Outcast was odd. What I guess I didn’t say was that I knew it at the time and was more than fine with the pick. If I hadn’t made that oddball pick…. Spire Monitor, Blighted Agent, or Vault Skirge would have been my pick. Even the Probe or the Raptor were options. That makes Suture Priest sixth on my hypothetical list. How does he help me get there? If he is allowed to stick around because Opponent doesn’t want to waste removal then does he even perform as well as a Bleakcoven Vamp? That is does he ever give you that four point swing? I doubt it. There is so much collateral damage in this set, that he will die when Opponent chooses. He is on color. I’ll give you that, but I don’t think he is as amazing as some many people claim him to be.'
"p1p5 the souleater is another odd pick. Its off color, and not even that great in blue. The talisman gets you to cenobite, accelerates you and gains you life."
'If it is off color, and I just passed enough blue to suggest that perhaps it wasn’t, then we once again disagree on the worth of a card. Somehow, he always gets the job done for me and against me. It is the same job the Invisimancer had, and wasn’t too great at because of one toughness. Even as an artifact, he is more survivable. It combos very nicely with the Necropouncer as I stated in the draft. The Talisman is my next pick. I know its good, but there are two packs worth of acceleration to look forward to. I like your pick, I just like mine, too.'
"p1p7 the exarch is amazing in fast aggro decks, not so much in decks planning to play 7 drops. Forced worship is not too great, but still probably the pick."
'At this point I know I’m playing the Cenobite, Necropouncer, and Porcelain Legionnaire. Which ever pick I make here, I am 80% sure I will run. Mediocre removal or mediocre creature? You are probably correct, but I wanted to start filling in low-drops and hope for better removal. Would you pick Bonds of Quicksilver this early? Nope. Forced Worship is better than that, but very similar. I’m already going for the win, and to win I will need better removal than this.'
"p2p5 Dross ripper sucks, even when playing black. At that point you have one black card that isnt worth splashing, and multiple green cards/blue cards. Copper carapace or mirran mettle wouldve been the pick."
'I disagree that Dross Ripper Sucks. I strongly disagree that it sucks when in Black. I disagree that the Imp is not worth splashing. At his point I am WU maybe splashing Green, and unlikely splashing Black. I won’t splash for Mirran Mettle and I do not want Copper Carapace for this deck. Despite all of my arguments so far, we have been very close to agreeing with everything so far, but not this… not by a mile.'
"Dude, you've got to stop doing things like:
P1P4: "Not happy to have such a high curve so far!"
P1P5: *Takes mediocre Souleater over PRISTINE TALISMAN to accelerate/buy time*
Taking Exarch over Forced Worship, in a deck that wants nothing else (to that point) but to get to the late game, doesn't seem correct either. Any particular reason for that?"
'Both answered above.'
"Past that - fun draft, some awkward SOM opens for sure. I think you should have staked claim to either U or G earlier, but it worked out fine, and shows how NMS really rewards staying open."
'Thanks, I hope the videos made it fun. Go through the first pack again. My only chances to stake claim to Blue any earlier were the Spire Monitor P1P3 over the Green Outcast and the Souleater P1P5. Oh wait, I did take the Souleater there. . There were no Green choices better than White. I think I got into Blue at just the right time, and cut it pretty hard in pack 2.'
"Videos look pretty slick. Sound isnt that big a deal for me. The notes are nice, a lot of typos, but a good touch. Overall a big improvement on the last draft you posted."
'Thanks. I noticed one typo, “Go for the Throat,” but was far to sick of the whole process to look out for them all. Now that I have an understanding of the process, I can spend more time on the typos. I also guessed that I misspelled Oculus a bunch of times.'
"R1:G1 8:25 Opp at 2 with 2 blockers, you have 4 1/1's. 9:40 Opp at 2 with 2 blockers, you have 4 1/1's."
'Look again. I had three creatures that could attack, Perilous Myr (which I acknowledged should have attacked) Oculus, and Copper Myr. Suture Priest had just come in. If I swung with the team, I am poisoned by the Reaper, and the Throatseeker is unleashed. Attacking with the team was one way to lose. Not attacking with the Myr was an obvious mistake. But again, I acknowledged that.'
"Playing land you can't possibly need immediately after drawing it is just terrible. Why give your opponent more information? At least wait until after combat."
'Again, I pointed that out myself.'
"You play extremely conservatively with perilous myr and necropouncer/just getting in there multiple times. This is highlighted in R1/2. I'm not even going to mess with your other possible errors in judgement."
'I’m still trying to find what you might be talking about here. But so far, you have only pointed out things that I have pointed out myself.'
"Your opponents make an insane amount of on board misplays."
'I pointed that out as well.'
"I guess I just don't see what makes this draft particularly relevant."
'!?!'
"Author is rather fresh MTG player (have less then 2 years of experience).
So, huge amount of mistakes is OK.
Bad thing is that he does not notice his mistakes after long time spent on editing videos."
'It sounds like you are commenting on the comments of others. Did you find any mistakes? Ones I didn’t find? So far, nobody has other than my ‘overvaluing’ of Trespassing Souleater.'
Scouting.
Mutagenic Growth, Phyrexian Jugger, Spine Bitter, Rot Wolf, Blightwidow. And, I've only seen 14 cards to this point. He has two heavy hitter finishers in the Jugger and Spine Biter, and I didn't want the infect count to get too high from the little guy just to have his finishers come out and give me one turn to deal with them or else.
I REALLY LIKED the article. In fact, I really liked BOTH articles in the series.
I don't check out all that many articles on PureMtGO, and the ones I do look at I often skim. I actually read (no skimming) both of the "My Plunge into Online Legacy" articles.
I don't find them rambling or half-baked in terms of their structure or content. I find the content well organized and formatted.
I also don't get the other poster's criticism about his playtesting "evidence". Evidence? His wording makes it very clear to me that he plays a lot of games and tests out cards (including suggestions by others) within his playtesting to address specific encountered problem areas and then see how effective the changes prove to be. He even mentions trends in whats showing up in the meta and how that influenced decisions. And it's not like he playtested a couple games one night and wrote the follow-up article on results the next day: it's been 20-days between articles.
To me, this series so far is about a guy who decided to play non-casual Legacy on MTGO ("take the plunge") and he's giving us a full blow-by-blow breakdown on the different things he's encountering on his journey:
* where he came from (Magic-wise)
* why he took the plunge
* what he had expected, what he found
* how he is making deckbuilding decisions/changes with strategy, playstyle preference, and transition budget* in mind.
I REALLY HOPE he CONTINUES with this EXACT format and series.
I dip my feet in MTGO Legacy from time to time and am curious about the scene. I also like to know what a player new MTGO Legacy is encountering. I also like to see this kind of article as a gentle push (to join) to those on the fence about making the plunge from paper to online or from other online formats to online Legacy.
Mr. Author: Please keep doing the exact thing you are doing. I don't want draft rundowns (I have no interest in limited), I don't need video articles (they can be fine for showing how a specific matchup or new deck type is played, but they are so narrow/limited in terms of communicating deck evolution compared to the concise synopsis style you provide now.), etc.
What I want is "My Plunge into Online Legacy Pt. 3" (with another ~20 day period of playtesting in-between articles to give you a ton of great insight/experience/journey/tinkering content)
More Please :)
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* transition budget - as a competitive player, I dislike people trying to play Legacy with budget decks or swap out key cards of good decks with weaker budget versions and be done with it. But here the author is making it clear that he is attempting to try to play with the best deck he can afford (that is also in-line with his playstyle preference), and then we get to see how that goes, and then he assures us he will be modding the deck as he injects cash into it. That is doubly great for me since (1) we get to see how a player (new to MTGO Legacy) trying to crack the format on a transition budget fares, (2) because he is not trying to half-a*s it, but is going full Spike playtest-wise, and (3) we know he is going to ramp it up to be full non-budget.
Personally I think that the drawback would be more playable if it was 'You skip you're draw step' the third ability is 'Pay 3 life : Draw a card'.
In terms of the drawback, I think that it makes the card more open to general use, because it lets you use Brainstorm style draw and return cards, which would be key to making this comboable and interesting. Indeed any other draw effects which you practically need in a combo deck are dead once the enchantment is down. As it stands yes you can ponder and preordain but without getting a card makes it a bit brutal. Particularly, since you had diving tops in mind, it seems weird that you sacrifice half the card. If you just skip the draw step, you can use diving top to combo for card advantage (draw a card and put diving top on top of your library in your opponents EoT... oh how convenient a permanent on top).
Paying 3 life each to draw through your library in hopes of a game winner makes me a little unhappy and you should be able to use mana to do that too even if only through other cards.
Other than that, the concept has real potential if you have the inclination. Deciever Exarch + this + fatty = glee. Hell if you want to try that route you could maybe play a successful BUG/Lotus cobra variant.